watsa_is_a_randian_hero Posted May 30, 2014 Share Posted May 30, 2014 I find it quite interesting that you misquoted me. I never said, "There is something more important though that is happening here. The question "Do I have enough?"". Apologies... I set up the quote wrong when posting. That was intended to be a quote/reply to longinvestor (he wrote that). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watsa_is_a_randian_hero Posted May 30, 2014 Share Posted May 30, 2014 To quote Nathaniel Brandon from the Six Pillars of Self Esteem (a fabulous book) I see I have a fellow objectivist here... :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkbabang Posted May 30, 2014 Share Posted May 30, 2014 Nassim Taleb proposes 'anti-wealth' as a true measure of satisfaction with your financial position. It is the difference between what you have and how much you want. It seems much more appropriate than any absolute measure. I don't know about that. I am pretty satisfied with my position, but I can't imagine being in a state where I didn't want more. What would get you up in the morning? It's like when you go on vacation, the first few days are like heaven, but at some point (5 days or so) you can't wait to get back home. I think having everything you think you want would be like that. The first 6-months, maybe a year, would be awesome, but then you would simply have to set your sights higher so that you could get back to work and be useful again. There should always be a discrepancy between what you have and what you want, otherwise you'd have no motivation to do anything at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest longinvestor Posted May 30, 2014 Share Posted May 30, 2014 Most of us value invest not for the proceeds but because we love the process......There is something more important though that is happening here. The question "Do I have enough?" I value invest not because I love the process but because I love the results. I value invest because I'm competitive and value investing is the best, easiest process for me to use to produce above-average results. In terms of the question "Do I have enough"...I would interpret this similarly to how I would expect Buffett would. I will keep my competitive drive for more long after recognizing that I have enough. For me having enough is only part of it. I want to do the best I possibly can and earn the most I possibly can, and see how well I can do. I will probably end up donating much of it in the end of life (similar to Buffett), but I still have a competitive drive to see how well I can do in the interim...And viewing the results of a NW poll is part of measuring how well I am doing so far. Since you intended to reply to my earlier reply to your original post, wanted to clarify, the question "Do I have enough" is not meant to be the same as "I'm done and hanging up my boots". There was a time in life when I clearly knew that we did not have enough. Being very successful (relative to 99% of the population) as a value investor has brought on that question often in my mind. I am smugly confident that this question will stop circling my head because one of these days, I will know that there is enough. My question "Do I have enough?" is taken right off Buffett as well. His views have influenced my giving behavior enough that I have designated a chunk of my retirement assets to a charitable organization(not wait until end of life when we are likely to make inferior choices as Buffett has told the 100+ Billionaires) to allow compounding to work for that cause as well as it has done for me and my family. As I watch my NW progress, I find myself gloating over the NW of the charity account as well. Below is my post. +1, very well stated. The net worth poll serves to boost the ego for doing something right. It validates, comprehensively, faith in value investing like nothing else can. Seeing yourself jump a notch or 2 or 3 up from where you started thinking about NW is a shot in the arm for sure. Of course, this can make one cocky and miserable company. And envy does prevail doesn't it? There is something more important though that is happening here. The question "Do I have enough?". Surely, there is a point when more important thoughts replace this one. It is great to listen to people who have already been there, and have crystallized their thoughts around this for a long time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ukvalueinvestment Posted May 30, 2014 Share Posted May 30, 2014 I think I shall be happy if I can give my kids enough money that they can value invest their way to being rich, should they choose. For me, that is £0.5mln, at the age of 18. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shalab Posted May 31, 2014 Author Share Posted May 31, 2014 Gio - checked out your for profit website, looks impressive. (though I had to use google transalte). You should consider listing your firm on over the counter market - like PGNT, SEDN etc. You get to be public and given your age, ethics and returns - I am sure a bunch of people will invest with you. OTOH, looks like 37% of the people that took the net worth poll are millionaires - pretty impressive. P.S: The U.S average for millionaires as a percent of the population is 4.2% just curious, what kind of business did you set up? Or what kind of industry if you dont want to be specific. Don’t mind at all! Why should I?! Wasn’t Ben Franklin who said “Be just and truthful to anyone, and don’t worry what people know or think about you”?... Anyway, something similar! ;) I have nothing to hide. And therefore don’t bother to. Actually, you find the link to both my operating companies (for profit education and civil engineering services) in my Forum Profile. Then I have a third company that gathers the free cash of the first two and invests it (or at least tries not to throw it away!! ;D ;D). Gio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stahleyp Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 Nassim Taleb proposes 'anti-wealth' as a true measure of satisfaction with your financial position. It is the difference between what you have and how much you want. It seems much more appropriate than any absolute measure. I don't know about that. I am pretty satisfied with my position, but I can't imagine being in a state where I didn't want more. What would get you up in the morning? Personally, I'd hate being in that position (always wanting more). That isn't peace. I have plenty of things to wake me up in the morning (family, friends, learning, etc). When I get to a certain level, it's hard for me to believe I'd want more and more (at least to big degree). I'd prefer money to not control me. Rather, I'd much prefer to control it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giofranchi Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 (though I had to use google transalte). Hi shalab! Yeah… You are right… The website is a bit dated… But we are in the midst of completely renewing it, with the implementation of an e-commerce platform. Through our master courses over the years we have created a good library of technical contents, that are updated each year and that I think might be very useful to a lot of professionals in the civil engineering field. The e-commerce platform is supposed to address those professionals who don't have the time nor the willingness to enroll in a master course which lasts a full year... This way, instead, they will be able to access and download only the contents they are really interested to dig deeper into, and which they know might have a practical use in their daily working life. Of course, the new website will have an English version! ;) Cheers! Gio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorrofan Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 Nassim Taleb proposes 'anti-wealth' as a true measure of satisfaction with your financial position. It is the difference between what you have and how much you want. It seems much more appropriate than any absolute measure. I don't know about that. I am pretty satisfied with my position, but I can't imagine being in a state where I didn't want more. What would get you up in the morning? Personally, I'd hate being in that position (always wanting more). That isn't peace. I have plenty of things to wake me up in the morning (family, friends, learning, etc). When I get to a certain level, it's hard for me to believe I'd want more and more (at least to big degree). I'd prefer money to not control me. Rather, I'd much prefer to control it. Keynes was quoted as saying "Money is a fine servant but a terrible Master". You may agree or disagree with his economic viewpoint but he did throw a heck of a party (so I'm told) ;D cheers Zorro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
randomep Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 Has anyone ever wondered what it takes to be in the much-publicized top 1%? And therefore conclude how many of us are in that category? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watsa_is_a_randian_hero Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 Has anyone ever wondered what it takes to be in the much-publicized top 1%? And therefore conclude how many of us are in that category? While the press often speaks about "wealth" of the top 1% in terms of income, if you were to actually look at it in terms of net worth the most recent research I saw indicated around $6mm. HOWEVER, much of this research is often very nuanced to me and not clearly specified. I did email capgemini regarding their wealth survey and they clarified that it does refer to INDIVIDUAL net worth, not HOUSEHOLD. So for you and your wife to be counted as a HNWI, you need 2mm jointly in investable assets (not net worth), as opposed to a single individual needing only 1mm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
randomep Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 Has anyone ever wondered what it takes to be in the much-publicized top 1%? And therefore conclude how many of us are in that category? While the press often speaks about "wealth" of the top 1% in terms of income, if you were to actually look at it in terms of net worth the most recent research I saw indicated around $6mm. HOWEVER, much of this research is often very nuanced to me and not clearly specified. I did email capgemini regarding their wealth survey and they clarified that it does refer to INDIVIDUAL net worth, not HOUSEHOLD. So for you and your wife to be counted as a HNWI, you need 2mm jointly in investable assets (not net worth), as opposed to a single individual needing only 1mm. I've read some studies also and I have seen the 99th percentile networth being from $2mil to $8mil. but I am very skeptical of the high end of that range. If it is 6-8 mil it means that if you look at a typical specialist doctor who works his way up from college to intern to specialist with a loan to pay off, there is not way he/she can accumulate that much with a normal lifestyle assuming that he/she has savings growth say at the rate of inflation. And specialists are probably like what? one in a thousand? I personally think it is $2 mil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stahleyp Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 Has anyone ever wondered what it takes to be in the much-publicized top 1%? And therefore conclude how many of us are in that category? http://money.cnn.com/2014/06/01/luxury/rich-wealth-gap/index.html?iid=HP_LN This doesn't spell it out precisely, but over $4 million should get your fairly close. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
randomep Posted June 1, 2014 Share Posted June 1, 2014 Has anyone ever wondered what it takes to be in the much-publicized top 1%? And therefore conclude how many of us are in that category? http://money.cnn.com/2014/06/01/luxury/rich-wealth-gap/index.html?iid=HP_LN This doesn't spell it out precisely, but over $4 million should get your fairly close. That seems to say $4mil per household is the cutoff, so I assume $2mil per person? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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