Edward Posted December 1, 2020 Share Posted December 1, 2020 Bottom line here seems to be that for a small listed company, the minimum expenses are just too much. I believe Steven Kiel mentioned that for his company, it is 400K$ just minimum corporate expenses per year to keep up the corporate structure. For a company that has say 10M$ in Equity, that is a 4% headwind right there, and this is before management gets paid. So I don't know how you can expect out sized returns in this scenario. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERICOPOLY Posted December 1, 2020 Share Posted December 1, 2020 Bottom line here seems to be that for a small listed company, the minimum expenses are just too much. I believe Steven Kiel mentioned that for his company, it is 400K$ just minimum corporate expenses per year to keep up the corporate structure. For a company that has say 10M$ in Equity, that is a 4% headwind right there, and this is before management gets paid. So I don't know how you can expect out sized returns in this scenario. If you are correct about that (and I haven't looked into it), I just wanted to ask is the market cap $10m? My source has it at $2.6m. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edward Posted December 1, 2020 Share Posted December 1, 2020 I'm talking about Equity, not Market cap. Can't pay people in Market cap. Premier Diversified Holdings had just under 400K canadian dollars in Equity in June 30 2020. Total assets just under 3M. Edit: The corporate expense annual run rate seems like 700-800K canadian dollars. It is obviously too much for the size. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregmal Posted December 1, 2020 Share Posted December 1, 2020 If these guys have any hope, they need to start paying salaries and whatever expenses possible in stock and make those shares restricted for at least 12 months. Otherwise, this is a triple donut, rather than the current double donut. 0.015>0.00 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERICOPOLY Posted December 1, 2020 Share Posted December 1, 2020 I'm talking about Equity, not Market cap. Can't pay people in Market cap. I was addressing investor returns, not employee pay, and doing so because of your prior statement: So I don't know how you can expect out sized returns in this scenario. My point is only that outside returns are a possibility if various things are fixed and this traded up near the value of said equity even if that were to take many years because a 4% annual drag on $10m is weighed against the market cap. I probably misunderstood what you were meaning to confer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OracleofCarolina Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 from today's press release CMCC announced its intention to distribute up to 32,488,344 Common shares (the "Shares") of the Company. The Shares are registered in the name of MPIC Fund I, LP ("MPIC") and CMCC has control or direction over the Shares. The Shares are being distributed in connection with redemption requests made by exiting members of MPIC. The Shares are being disposed of at a deemed value of $0.015 per Share, for a total deemed disposition value of $487,325. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ourkid8 Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 I just want to clarify, CMCC is selling PDH shares to fund redemption requests? from today's press release CMCC announced its intention to distribute up to 32,488,344 Common shares (the "Shares") of the Company. The Shares are registered in the name of MPIC Fund I, LP ("MPIC") and CMCC has control or direction over the Shares. The Shares are being distributed in connection with redemption requests made by exiting members of MPIC. The Shares are being disposed of at a deemed value of $0.015 per Share, for a total deemed disposition value of $487,325. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERICOPOLY Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 I just want to clarify, CMCC is selling PDH shares to fund redemption requests? from today's press release CMCC announced its intention to distribute up to 32,488,344 Common shares (the "Shares") of the Company. The Shares are registered in the name of MPIC Fund I, LP ("MPIC") and CMCC has control or direction over the Shares. The Shares are being distributed in connection with redemption requests made by exiting members of MPIC. The Shares are being disposed of at a deemed value of $0.015 per Share, for a total deemed disposition value of $487,325. A long time ago it was announced that to meet a redemption an MPIC investor's pro-rata investment in the fund's PDH position would be distributed directly to said investor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bizaro86 Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 I just want to clarify, CMCC is selling PDH shares to fund redemption requests? from today's press release CMCC announced its intention to distribute up to 32,488,344 Common shares (the "Shares") of the Company. The Shares are registered in the name of MPIC Fund I, LP ("MPIC") and CMCC has control or direction over the Shares. The Shares are being distributed in connection with redemption requests made by exiting members of MPIC. The Shares are being disposed of at a deemed value of $0.015 per Share, for a total deemed disposition value of $487,325. No, someone is redeeming and they are giving them their pro-rata share of the PDH position. It would probably be hard to sell that many in a reasonable time frame, so this option makes sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edward Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 My point is only that outside returns are a possibility if various things are fixed and this traded up near the value of said equity even if that were to take many years because a 4% annual drag on $10m is weighed against the market cap. The way I see it, the moment you have even a 1-2% of drag, a discount is warranted on the Equity. In this case, the expenses are 800K CAD, which even in a 10M equity scenario is an 8% drag. So it wouldn't be the normal 10-20% discount to book value but something crazy probably, like 50% or less. I manage a small fund and if I had fixed costs like that, I wouldn't feel comfortable with anything less than a 100M$ assets under management, much less 10M$. It's not like someone can promise me consistent 20% returns, so an 8% drag might be reasonable under the circumstances. If I can invest in Berkshire and get me 8-10% semi-consistently, it's some tough competition. Only way to compete with the Berkshire alternative in my opinion is to get the fixed costs to under 0.5% first, then do performance fees only. That's assuming the return is there to begin with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spekulatius Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 Why would anyone buy into this ? It‘s basically an extremely high cost Angel investment. They are printing shares to pay insiders salaries. I have seen frauds that have better chances of return quite frankly. I know, I repeat myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clutch Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 Why would anyone buy into this ? It‘s basically an extremely high cost Angel investment. They are printing shares to pay insiders salaries. I have seen frauds that have better chances of return quite frankly. I know, I repeat myself. I don't think anyone is buying this now, but there are a handful of people on this board who bought this years ago and wondering wth is going on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkbabang Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 Why would anyone buy into this ? It‘s basically an extremely high cost Angel investment. They are printing shares to pay insiders salaries. I have seen frauds that have better chances of return quite frankly. I know, I repeat myself. I don't think anyone is buying this now, but there are a handful of people on this board who bought this years ago and wondering wth is going on. I'm in this situation. When it was a smallish position to begin with and it's down ~90%, it isn't even worth selling. So I'm just considering this a 0, holding, and wondering if they can turn things around someday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Libs Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 Why would anyone buy into this ? It‘s basically an extremely high cost Angel investment. They are printing shares to pay insiders salaries. I have seen frauds that have better chances of return quite frankly. I know, I repeat myself. I don't think anyone is buying this now, but there are a handful of people on this board who bought this years ago and wondering wth is going on. I'm in this situation. When it was a smallish position to begin with and it's down ~90%, it isn't even worth selling. So I'm just considering this a 0, holding, and wondering if they can turn things around someday. This was my line of thinking for quite a while. But you have to lance the boil at some point. It's just too depressing to keep on the books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkbabang Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 Why would anyone buy into this ? It‘s basically an extremely high cost Angel investment. They are printing shares to pay insiders salaries. I have seen frauds that have better chances of return quite frankly. I know, I repeat myself. I don't think anyone is buying this now, but there are a handful of people on this board who bought this years ago and wondering wth is going on. I'm in this situation. When it was a smallish position to begin with and it's down ~90%, it isn't even worth selling. So I'm just considering this a 0, holding, and wondering if they can turn things around someday. This was my line of thinking for quite a while. But you have to lance the boil at some point. It's just too depressing to keep on the books. Saving it for when I need some tax losses. Although I also have some in my IRA, I don't know why I'm not selling that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
compoundinglife Posted February 10, 2021 Share Posted February 10, 2021 Stumbled across the Purposely beta site, accepting applications for beta customers: https://beta.purposely.co/ Looks like you can track news on the service/product updates on the "what's new" section of the website. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drzola Posted February 23, 2021 Share Posted February 23, 2021 Over 1 Million shares just changed hands today? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drzola Posted February 23, 2021 Share Posted February 23, 2021 2.35 million shares changed hands last trade @$0.035 Cents or 75% higher then days low? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karthikpm Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 Interesting, who's buying ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurgis Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 WSB! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drzola Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 CMCC and MPIC might be taking PDH Private it appears? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lschmidt Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 Seems possible. But ask this: are there other ways to unlock the value of the early stage private company shares, and might cleaning up the balance sheet be a step toward that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spekulatius Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 Seems possible. But ask this: are there other ways to unlock the value of the early stage private company shares, and might cleaning up the balance sheet be a step toward that? What value is there to unlock? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lschmidt Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 30+% ownership of Mycare Medtech Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OracleofCarolina Posted March 22, 2021 Share Posted March 22, 2021 and Zed Therapeutics Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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