Mohnish Pabrai blog

[Parsad]

Clarifying question?  Did he state he had an MBA or was an Alumnus of HBS?  If I understand the list, it would allow him to say he was an alumnus of HBS but it would not allow him to say he had an MBA from HBS.  Or am I missing something?

 

BTW, the argument that he couldn't have lied because he had nothing to gain from it, is not very strong (i.e., proof). Just because someone has nothing to gain doesn't mean they wouldn't lie.

 

I think you are splitting hairs.  He essentially has the same thing he had posted on there before, except he's clarified how it was granted.  Cheers!

[hardincap]

Maybe you guys owe him an apology. 

 

Many of you are students of Munger and his belief on incentives.  Ask yourself what incentive there is for a man who is worth $80M, spends only about $250-300K a year, whose hedge fund is not open to new investors and is already asked to speak and attend all sorts of prestigious conferences?  What incentive does he have to lie about a Harvard MBA and risk all of that?

 

This reminds me of when he bought the lunch with Buffett, but paid for it through the foundation he set up.  I remember people skewering him over that.  He gave the f**king money away...does it matter if he got a lunch out of it?

 

You guys really need to spend more time on your investments and less time worrying about other people!  Cheers!

 

really? imo, this is like getting called out by a potential employer after a background check for having misrepresented my education history on a job application, and then saying but look at what a great guy i am, what reason do I have to lie? cmon now. im not saying pabrai isn't a great guy; in fact i love his approach to "investing" in students and have modeled my own approach to giving in a similar way. and its not about "worrying about other people", its about noticing errors in judgment and understanding why/where it comes from. CEOs getting caught misrepresenting their resume comes up over and over on WSJ, its a curious thing

[oscarazocar]

He stated that he had an MBA from Harvard, not that he was an alumnus.  That is a big difference, and it's not one you can gloss over.    Those terms have specific meanings.  Having an MBA means you were granted that degree.

 

If you intern at Goldman Sachs, maybe you can call yourself an alumnus of the company, but you can't say you were a partner.

 

Pabrai is savvy enough that he knows the difference.  Having a Harvard MBA is a prestigious thing and my guess is that he was trying to conflate the MBA/alumnus distinction.

 

 

 

 

 

[investmd]

He stated that he had an MBA from Harvard, not that he was an alumnus.  That is a big difference, and it's not one you can gloss over.    Those terms have specific meanings.  Having an MBA means you were granted that degree.

 

If you intern at Goldman Sachs, maybe you can call yourself an alumnus of the company, but you can't say you were a partner.

 

Pabrai is savvy enough that he knows the difference.  Having a Harvard MBA is a prestigious thing and my guess is that he was trying to conflate the MBA/alumnus distinction.

 

Congratulations, you may have played a part in the correction of Pabrai's profile.  Hope you get some satisfaction from feeling that you may have helped future investors from being misled and that was your intent.

 

In Racemize's post earlier today on results of an all star list of value investors from original Buffett partnership to current, Pabrai makes the list as one of only 18 selected. In addition, his results are top 5 when it comes to annual return over life of fund (13.9%/yr) and average annual results over S&P 500 for life of fund - 8%/yr. Results over rolling 10 year periods not as stellar as others.

 

He's admitted to learning from mistakes, produced a checklist to cut down on mistakes and thus wouldn't surprise me if future results are even better.

 

Regardless of "listed profile" or results, some members of this Board don't think they should follow his actions and that's perfectly fine.

Agree with Prasad's comments here - focus on how we can be better investors.

 

 

[tombgrt]

 

+1! 

 

Maybe you guys owe him an apology. 

 

Many of you are students of Munger and his belief on incentives.  Ask yourself what incentive there is for a man who is worth $80M, spends only about $250-300K a year, whose hedge fund is not open to new investors and is already asked to speak and attend all sorts of prestigious conferences?  What incentive does he have to lie about a Harvard MBA and risk all of that?

 

 

Status? Prestige? Ego? As if being rich and accomplished made you immune to those. Just look at that Trump figure. Why does he do all that crazy bullshiting? He's rich right? What incentive does he have for all his lies?

 

No matter how great a guy is, he can also have some personality flaws. And that's just fine, no one is perfect. If I was as rich as him, I might turn in a complete turd!

[cubsfan]

Pabrai bashers out in force again, I see.  You guys never give up.

 

Parsad has it right - really,  don't you guys have better things to do?

[stahleyp]

Just because folks are critical of Pabrai doesn't mean they're wrong. I like Pabrai overall but some of the things he says/does are misleading. 

[cubsfan]

Just because folks are critical of Pabrai doesn't mean they're wrong. I like Pabrai overall but some of the things he says/does are misleading.

 

Yea, but this thread is over the top when it comes to bashing the guy.

[oddballstocks]

Just because folks are critical of Pabrai doesn't mean they're wrong. I like Pabrai overall but some of the things he says/does are misleading.

 

I get that people like the guy and are invested in his funds.  But lying on your resume isn't ok.  You don't just say "oh whoops, I guess he typed that in wrong on LinkedIn."

 

My dad used to say "Don't trust anyone who takes a mulligan" because if someone is willing to lie on something small and meaningless like a golf hole then they're willing to lie on bigger things as well.  It's a character issue.

 

I recognize we all have flaws and are all flawed, but people need to decide what is acceptable to themselves.  Seems most in this thread are ok with a manager who is willing to lie to make themselves look better.  It isn't a character trait I'd be ok with, but I'm also not an investor in his funds.

 

[abyli]

Just because folks are critical of Pabrai doesn't mean they're wrong. I like Pabrai overall but some of the things he says/does are misleading.

 

I get that people like the guy and are invested in his funds.  But lying on your resume isn't ok.  You don't just say "oh whoops, I guess he typed that in wrong on LinkedIn."

 

My dad used to say "Don't trust anyone who takes a mulligan" because if someone is willing to lie on something small and meaningless like a golf hole then they're willing to lie on bigger things as well.  It's a character issue.

 

I recognize we all have flaws and are all flawed, but people need to decide what is acceptable to themselves.  Seems most in this thread are ok with a manager who is willing to lie to make themselves look better.  It isn't a character trait I'd be ok with, but I'm also not an investor in his funds.

 

Agree.

[bennycx]

How competitive are these executive programmes at HBS?

Once I had someone told me he is Harvard MBA but when investigated further just had a high school education + one of these exec programmes

[Parsad]

Just because folks are critical of Pabrai doesn't mean they're wrong. I like Pabrai overall but some of the things he says/does are misleading.

 

I get that people like the guy and are invested in his funds.  But lying on your resume isn't ok.  You don't just say "oh whoops, I guess he typed that in wrong on LinkedIn."

 

My dad used to say "Don't trust anyone who takes a mulligan" because if someone is willing to lie on something small and meaningless like a golf hole then they're willing to lie on bigger things as well.  It's a character issue.

 

I recognize we all have flaws and are all flawed, but people need to decide what is acceptable to themselves.  Seems most in this thread are ok with a manager who is willing to lie to make themselves look better.  It isn't a character trait I'd be ok with, but I'm also not an investor in his funds.

 

Do you think he really lied, or do you think it was an oversight on how clear he should be about how the status was granted?

 

The original Linkedin said "Harvard Masters of Business Administration/Business/Commerce/General".  You look at the list of ways and programs Harvard grants the alumnus status and tell me what he should have put on there.  It's a confusing mess isn't it?  He didn't say solely "Harvard Masters of Business Administration".  I think you hit it on the head with your comment...something small and meaningless...I believe it was to Pabrai until everyone stirred up the hornets nest on here. 

 

Also, the comment that "most in this thread are ok with a manager who is willing to lie to make themselves look better" is really just silly!  Suggesting that some of us are ok with it...kind of a low blow. 

 

A few weeks ago, it was Allan Mecham, then Mohnish...next week will it be Francis again?  There are alot of bad guys out there managing money...both in performance and ethically...yet I keep finding so many going after some of the actual good guys in the business. 

 

So many of you send me your letters monthly, quarterly, etc.  I bet I could tear each one apart and find something..from big omission or error, to small oversight.  People make errors...they aren't always trying to deceive people through those errors.  Cheers!

[jobyts]

 

Pabrai talks about 3 mental models here. The first one he mentions is interesting in this context... ::)

 

 

[stahleyp]

I agree that the Harvard thing could be an oversight (the changing of the years is a little weird to me though).

 

On another note, I don't see how alluding to compounding at 26% while compounding at rates quite a bit lower than that is an oversight.

[tombgrt]

I agree that the Harvard thing could be an oversight (the changing of the years is a little weird to me though).

 

On another note, I don't see how alluding to compounding at 26% while compounding at rates quite a bit lower than that is an oversight.

 

Exactly. But previous events like that just make me think the Harvard thing isn't an oversight. Who in their right mind believes such a thing won't be misconstrued? I'm extremely careful about what I put on my CV and Linkedin as I know how sensitive these things are and I'm barely visible to the outside world. As a very visible investment manager you should simply be mindful about what you say and post online.

 

People are only bitching about it because fan boys seem to be claiming guys like Pabrai are saints that can't do anything wrong. We know he gives to charity, has stellar investment results and does events, truly amazing! Kinda promoting that image too (which is fine). Using those facts as a counterarguement to his misleading behavior simply makes no sense. Stop doing that and people will also care less about the "oversights" of that person. Like was said before by many, we all have flaws. I don't see the rationale for saying "It's not bad because he is otherwise a great guy." That actually made me want to respond to something I otherwise care little about in general.

[cubsfan]

You guys take so much of this out of context. Pabrai compounded at high rates for several years, that's old news.

Then he hits a rough patch, and he's a bum and a fraud, and a pretender. Ridiculous.

Then you talk that he's just a great salesman, and his sole goal is to raise money, etc.  But his funds are closed and he

takes it up the butt for 10 yrs with no fees, carrying his investors on his back the whole time. Promoting himself and

not even getting paid, going deeper and deeper in the hole.  Now there is a really smart sales guy!

 

You guys have all these "motives" for Pabrai. Get off your high horse already. No one said he was a saint.

 

So your "fan boys" try to bring some proportion to the discussion, while you "hypocrites" continue your character assassination.

[stahleyp]

Within the recent past he was promoting his idea of a 26% annual return (making a person think that's what he achieved -at least to me, but maybe I'm kinda slow). I believe this 2013 so before his recent poor performing years. Like I said, I think the good outweighs the bad but I don't see how this isn't misleading.  I do like that he doesn't charge fees when his performance isn't good, charity, willingness to share ideas, etc. If I do half as well in life as he has, I'd be pretty happy.

[cubsfan]

His annual returns and historical returns are made available every year to his investors and those that attend his meetings.

 

It's all right there out in the open.

[Tim Eriksen]

You guys take so much of this out of context. Pabrai compounded at high rates for several years, that's old news.

Then he hits a rough patch, and he's a bum and a fraud, and a pretender. Ridiculous.

Then you talk that he's just a great salesman, and his sole goal is to raise money, etc.  But his funds are closed and he

takes it up the butt for 10 yrs with no fees, carrying his investors on his back the whole time. Promoting himself and

not even getting paid, going deeper and deeper in the hole.  Now there is a really smart sales guy!

 

You guys have all these "motives" for Pabrai. Get off your high horse already. No one said he was a saint.

 

So your "fan boys" try to bring some proportion to the discussion, while you "hypocrites" continue your character assassination.

 

Wow.  Someone points out a misrepresentation or lie in his linkedin profile, and now they are the bad guys with evil intent (hypocrites committing character assassination).  Way to twist things. 

 

 

[longlake95]

This thread is pointless. Let's stick to figuring what companies are worth and buying them cheap. Pabrai is a great investor.

[oscarazocar]

Just because folks are critical of Pabrai doesn't mean they're wrong. I like Pabrai overall but some of the things he says/does are misleading.

 

I get that people like the guy and are invested in his funds.  But lying on your resume isn't ok.  You don't just say "oh whoops, I guess he typed that in wrong on LinkedIn."

 

My dad used to say "Don't trust anyone who takes a mulligan" because if someone is willing to lie on something small and meaningless like a golf hole then they're willing to lie on bigger things as well.  It's a character issue.

 

I recognize we all have flaws and are all flawed, but people need to decide what is acceptable to themselves.  Seems most in this thread are ok with a manager who is willing to lie to make themselves look better.  It isn't a character trait I'd be ok with, but I'm also not an investor in his funds.

 

Do you think he really lied, or do you think it was an oversight on how clear he should be about how the status was granted?

 

The original Linkedin said "Harvard Masters of Business Administration/Business/Commerce/General".  You look at the list of ways and programs Harvard grants the alumnus status and tell me what he should have put on there.  It's a confusing mess isn't it?  He didn't say solely "Harvard Masters of Business Administration".  I think you hit it on the head with your comment...something small and meaningless...I believe it was to Pabrai until everyone stirred up the hornets nest on here. 

 

Also, the comment that "most in this thread are ok with a manager who is willing to lie to make themselves look better" is really just silly!  Suggesting that some of us are ok with it...kind of a low blow. 

 

A few weeks ago, it was Allan Mecham, then Mohnish...next week will it be Francis again?  There are alot of bad guys out there managing money...both in performance and ethically...yet I keep finding so many going after some of the actual good guys in the business. 

 

So many of you send me your letters monthly, quarterly, etc.  I bet I could tear each one apart and find something..from big omission or error, to small oversight.  People make errors...they aren't always trying to deceive people through those errors.  Cheers!

 

Yes, I really think he lied.  The original LinkedIn thread did not say what you wrote.  Don't take my word for it, look at the screenshot.

 

It said:

Harvard Business School

Master of Business Adminstration (MBA),Business/Commerce,General

2012

 

I have no idea what program he attended, but it is not murky or complicated to portray it accurately.  If it's a 1 month Exec Ed program, you write "Harvard Business School, Executive Education, May 2012".  You don't list a degree that you don't have.  Successful people make unnecessary misrepresentations like this all the time, and they get in big trouble for it.

[hardincap]

Wow.  Someone points out a misrepresentation or lie in his linkedin profile, and now they are the bad guys with evil intent (hypocrites committing character assassination).  Way to twist things.

 

+1. response is as "interesting" as the incident

[cubsfan]

 

Wow.  Someone points out a misrepresentation or lie in his linkedin profile, and now they are the bad guys with evil intent (hypocrites committing character assassination).  Way to twist things.

 

There's plenty of that in here. Some just worse than others.

[pabrai]

I have strong reservations about responding to mostly anonymous folks on message boards like this. Much of the smear is driven by envy – one of the worst human vices per Munger. You feel bad and don’t even get anything in return. The response to this post is gonna be irrational, but here goes:

 

My alum status from HBS status was granted in 2010 in a special ceremony at HBS. Here is what it says about my education on the Pabrai Funds website. This has not been changed/updated in 10-15 years:

 

“In 1986, Pabrai received a Bachelor's Degree from Clemson University in Computer Engineering. He completed coursework towards a Master's Degree in Electrical Engineering from the Illinois Institute of Technology, but did not finish his thesis due to the start-up of TransTech.”

 

And in the typical profile I am requested to send when speaking anywhere etc., it makes no mention of any degrees or institutions. No Clemson, IIT or HBS. This has also been the case for atleast 10-15 years.

 

As far as I am aware the only place where HBS appears is on LinkedIn. I created a LinkedIn profile many years ago as part of a HBS case we were doing. But it sat dormant and most unpopulated without much info on me for most of that time. About 12-14 months ago a person on my team suggested I get serious about social media. We talked about it and it led to the ChaiWithPabrai blog, setting up a twitter account and populating the LinkedIn profile. Until 12-14 months ago, I ignored LinkedIn and mostly ignored requests or messages etc. on it. A member of my staff populated my LinkedIn profile in consultation with me. That is when the HBS info was added.

 

I am a member of YPO. YPO and HBS have a unique relationship going back several decades. The YPO-Harvard program (or PPL – Presidents’ Program in Leadership) is a week on the HBS campus. It is a very intense week, requiring several weeks of advance prep. It is both exhausting and exhilarating. I did the program eleven times and in most years I’d rate it as the best week of the year for me. There are a limited number of seats annually and the program is heavily oversubscribed. One needs to be a YPO’er and then apply to attend. The waiting list takes a few years to clear. Once you attend, you are only invited back if you “did the work” and got a good rating from your group leader. We are setup in groups of 8-10 YPO’ers.

 

After nine years of attending the program HBS gives you alum status. Throughout the time I attended this alum status was discussed by participants as being the same as getting a HBS MBA. The HBS MBA admission program is altogether different. I have often thought about whether after nine years of doing the YPO HBS program whether it was equivalent to a HBS MBA.

 

In my opinion, the typical YPO’ers who have alum status from HBS as a group are vastly better at execution than the typical HBS MBA. The reason is that one needs to be running a successful business with some scale before YPO will let you join the organization. In some geographies, the bar is really high to join. After joining, you have to be accepted to attend the YPO-HBS program. And then be allowed to come back eight more times. There are 10,000+ YPO’ers and when I went through it, less than 350 seats a year for the program. Most folks keep coming back, so there aren’t that many open seats.

 

What I went through at HBS, in my opinion, was vastly superior to doing an MBA there. I was focused on applying the lessons learned immediately in my business. For example, the first year I attended planted the seeds to start Pabrai Funds. It meant moving from running a IT Services company to running an investment partnership with no prior experience. It was a huge 180 degree reset. It would not have happened if I had not gone to HBS. There would likely not be a Pabrai Funds today if I hadn’t spent a week in the YPO-HBS program in Jan/Feb 1999.

 

I hadn’t looked at my Linked In profile in much detail. I am responsible for it saying HBS MBA, even though I personally did not enter in that info. After I saw the thread I went in and corrected the profile immediately. It was the right thing to do. There was no attempt to mislead anyone. FWIW, the HBS alum status that is granted for the YPO program is absolutely at least equivalent to a HBS MBA and actually vastly superior (in my opinion).

 

I don’t think anyone has ever given me a dime to manage because they think I have a HBS MBA. This explanation is not gonna jive with those filled with envy. People have been taking potshots at Buffett for decades. If they can take potshots at Warren, then of course they are gonna take 100x those potshots at flawed mortals like me. I have grave misgivings about this long post (or any post), but decided to go ahead anyway. I won’t be responding. Nothing further to add on the subject from my side.

 

[LC]

FWIW, the HBS alum status that is granted for the YPO program is absolutely at least equivalent to a HBS MBA and actually vastly superior (in my opinion).

 

Maybe advertise that fact, then?