Coronavirus

[John Hjorth]

... I shudder to think of the safety of our healthcare workforce in the coming months. ...

 

The real soldiers of today, almost everywhere around the world.

[ERICOPOLY]

NYC will likely run out of respirators at a time when other parts of the country still have idle capacity in their ICUs.

 

People will get in their cars and drive to the nearest hospital with capacity.

 

When will geographic borders be sealed off?  Will they or won't they?

[UK]

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-03-23/swedes-try-laissez-faire-model-in-controversial-virus-response

[ERICOPOLY]

If Trump said it was a 'hoax' to undermine his re-election chances... shouldn't we invert and suspect that Trump deliberately downplayed the threat to keep his re-election chances alive? 

 

1.  We know he was tipped off in Jan by US intelligence, and he now admits that he "knew it was a pandemic all along".

2.  The Washington Post reported yesterday that he is focusing on his re-election chances, and that coincides with him downplaying the threat again yesterday.

 

It doesn't look good for our collective chances if his first priority is himself.

[Liberty]

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/24/bill-gates-us-missed-its-chance-to-avoid-coronavirus-shutdown.html

 

https://www.vox.com/recode/2020/3/24/21192638/coronavirus-bill-gates-trump-reopen-business

 

"Bill Gates says we can’t restart the economy soon and simply “ignore that pile of bodies over in the corner”"

[Liberty]

If Trump said it was a 'hoax' to undermine his re-election chances... shouldn't we invert and suspect that Trump deliberately downplayed the threat to keep his re-election chances alive? 

 

1.  We know he was tipped off in Jan by US intelligence, and he now admits that he "knew it was a pandemic all along".

2.  The Washington Post reported yesterday that he is focusing on his re-election chances, and that coincides with him downplaying the threat again yesterday.

 

It doesn't look good for our collective chances if his first priority is himself.

 

Of course his first priority is himself. He's a narcissistic personality disorder and likely a sociopath. He doesn't care about reopening for "the economy" in general, he knows this current path doesn't lead him to get re-elected, and it's really bad for his hotels and resorts and his debt payments, and if he's out of power it's dangerous that he'll be investigated without pardon power, so he's ready to gamble it all and put all his chips on 15 black and spin the wheel in the hope that this other approach may be better for his election and businesses. He's been incredibly lucky all his life, born to wealth, getting away with all kinds of stuff, becoming president.. He's just gambling with lots of lives and the US healthcare system in the balance that his luck will hold.

 

And he didn't know back then. He's not intellectually capable to have understood the implications when it was still theoretical, and he's surrounded by yes-men and he fires or drives away anyone who's independent-minded pretty quickly. Can you even imagine him reading complex briefings and diving into the details? He thinks in cable-TV soundbytes. Listen to him talk about any of this and it's just a bunch of word-salad "it's great, going tremendous, big effort"... No real understanding. Even now as people are dying and hospitals are being quickly turned into disaster zones, he's not listening to the people who know what they're talking about, he's driving away Fauci and contradicting his task force on TV and picking petty fights with desperate governors who need federal help. He's likely never even spoke to anyone on the front lines of this and shows zero empathy for anyone dealing with this, only worry for himself veiled in language about "the economy" (which was how he always said he measured his presidency, always talking about stock market records, etc).

[John Hjorth]

With regard to the situation in New York City [ref. ERICOPOLYs post about NYC], are there any [hard] data available somewhere to look at?

[ERICOPOLY]

If Trump said it was a 'hoax' to undermine his re-election chances... shouldn't we invert and suspect that Trump deliberately downplayed the threat to keep his re-election chances alive? 

 

1.  We know he was tipped off in Jan by US intelligence, and he now admits that he "knew it was a pandemic all along".

2.  The Washington Post reported yesterday that he is focusing on his re-election chances, and that coincides with him downplaying the threat again yesterday.

 

It doesn't look good for our collective chances if his first priority is himself.

 

Of course his first priority is himself. He's a narcissistic personality disorder and likely a sociopath. He doesn't care about reopening for "the economy" in general, he knows this current path doesn't lead him to get re-elected, and it's really bad for his hotels and resorts and his debt payments, and if he's out of power it's dangerous that he'll be investigated without pardon power, so he's ready to gamble it all and put all his chips on 15 black and spin the wheel in the hope that this other approach may be better for his election and businesses. He's been incredibly lucky all his life, born to wealth, getting away with all kinds of stuff, becoming president.. He's just gambling with lots of lives and the US healthcare system in the balance that his luck will hold.

 

And he didn't know back then. He's not intellectually capable to have understood the implications when it was still theoretical, and he's surrounded by yes-men and he fires or drives away anyone who's independent-minded pretty quickly. Listen to him talk about any of this and it's just a bunch of word-salad "it's great, going tremendous, big effort"... No real understanding. Even now as people are dying and hospitals are being quickly turned into disaster zones, he's not listening to the people who know what they're talking about, he's driving away Fauci and contradicting his task force on TV and picking petty fights with desperate governors who need federal help. He's likely never even spoke to anyone on the front lines of this and shows zero empathy for anyone dealing with this, only worry for himself veiled in language about "the economy" (which was how he always said he measured his presidency, always talking about stock market records, etc).

 

"it's great, going tremendous, big effort"

 

More like "it's very very great, going tremendous, quite tremendously, big big effort.  very big.  so big you won't believe but it's there and I'm almost always right about these things."

[LC]

With regard to the situation in New York City [ref. ERICOPOLYs post about NYC], are there any [hard] data available somewhere to look at?

 

https://www.ny1.com/nyc/all-boroughs/news/2020/03/24/cuomo--rate-of-coronavirus-infection-in-new-york-is-spiking

 

UPDATED 1:50 PM ET MAR. 24, 2020

 

There are now 25,665 positive cases confirmed in New York State, with 14,904 cases located in the city.

 

As of Tuesday, at least 210 deaths in the state have been linked to the coronavirus, 131 in the city alone.

 

Cuomo says 3,324 patients are currently hospitalized, 756 of those are in intensive care units.

 

The rate of hospitalization in the state is now 23 percent.

 

Speaking from the Javits Center in Manhattan, Cuomo says the focus remains on ramping up hospital capacity and equipment, especially ventilators.

 

The governor says it's expected the apex of the outbreak in New York is likely 14 to 21 days away.

 

So far, Cuomo says New York State has procured 7,000 ventilators, but anticipates needing 30,000.

 

The governor says the state will need upwards of 140,000 hospital beds to treat coronavirus patients, up from a previous estimate of 110,000.

 

 

 

 

[Viking]

If Trump said it was a 'hoax' to undermine his re-election chances... shouldn't we invert and suspect that Trump deliberately downplayed the threat to keep his re-election chances alive? 

 

1.  We know he was tipped off in Jan by US intelligence, and he now admits that he "knew it was a pandemic all along".

2.  The Washington Post reported yesterday that he is focusing on his re-election chances, and that coincides with him downplaying the threat again yesterday.

 

It doesn't look good for our collective chances if his first priority is himself.

 

Of course his first priority is himself. He's a narcissistic personality disorder and likely a sociopath. He doesn't care about reopening for "the economy" in general, he knows this current path doesn't lead him to get re-elected, and it's really bad for his hotels and resorts and his debt payments, and if he's out of power it's dangerous that he'll be investigated without pardon power, so he's ready to gamble it all and put all his chips on 15 black and spin the wheel in the hope that this other approach may be better for his election and businesses. He's been incredibly lucky all his life, born to wealth, getting away with all kinds of stuff, becoming president.. He's just gambling with lots of lives and the US healthcare system in the balance that his luck will hold.

 

And he didn't know back then. He's not intellectually capable to have understood the implications when it was still theoretical, and he's surrounded by yes-men and he fires or drives away anyone who's independent-minded pretty quickly. Listen to him talk about any of this and it's just a bunch of word-salad "it's great, going tremendous, big effort"... No real understanding. Even now as people are dying and hospitals are being quickly turned into disaster zones, he's not listening to the people who know what they're talking about, he's driving away Fauci and contradicting his task force on TV and picking petty fights with desperate governors who need federal help. He's likely never even spoke to anyone on the front lines of this and shows zero empathy for anyone dealing with this, only worry for himself veiled in language about "the economy" (which was how he always said he measured his presidency, always talking about stock market records, etc).

 

“word salad” . Had a very good hearty laugh after reading that description of Trump speaking. That will help when i listen to him in the future :-) Thank you Liberty

[james22]

Fuck off to the Politics section, would you?

[Liberty]

Fuck off to the Politics section, would you?

 

This isn't politics. This is a public health issue, and not a theoretical one. The person in charge is incompetent to deal with it. If you want to pretend this is politics, fine, but it isn't. I don't care he's right or left, blue or red, purple or orange. if he was acting rationally and competently in the face of the COVID19 threat, I'd applaud, but he's not, so I'm explaining why I think that is.

 

Now stay civil or get out.

[John Hjorth]

Thank you, LC,

 

Oh my God.

[Liberty]

CEO of Flexport on the supply chain challenges of getting enough PPE to frontline workers:

 

https://twitter.com/typesfast/status/1242490035707895808?s=20  (thread)

[Liberty]

Looking at the total cases chart, it took from January to March 5 to get to 100k cases.

 

It took from  March 5th to March 24th to get to 400k.

 

And most places, curves at still in their early, steep parts...

[ERICOPOLY]

 

So far, Cuomo says New York State has procured 7,000 ventilators, but anticipates needing 30,000.

 

 

 

And the rest of the country has the ventilators they need...  Bill Barr claims he will aggressively prosecute 'hoarding'.  Will he order hospitals with ventilators to share in order to save lives in NYC?

[Viking]

One would think that a priority of the Leader would be to get the country unified in its approach to dealing with the virus. KISS - keep it simple stupid.

 

I do agree that different regions in the US are at different stages in dealing with the health crisis. The differences are currently of a timing nature (the virus is pretty much the same the world over). Washington State is further along, followed by New York City. The data is pretty straight forward in how the virus is spreading nationally. So i can understand how each region would have a different approach to deal with the outbreak.

 

The real problem with talking about the post-virus world at this very early stage is it will likely cause most average Americans to mentally skip the current reality and ignore what needs to be done today. If we are a few weeks away from the post-virus world who gives a shit about what needs to be done today? Business as usual.

 

By all means discuss the post-virus world with experts behind the scene. But keep it out of the public eye for now. Win the war first before you start planning the victory parade with the public.

 

Imagine the war effort in the UK if two months into the Battle of Britain if Winston Churchill told the public that they should start thinking and planning  for getting back to their normal pre-war life. The enormous sacrifices needed to win the war would not have happened. But what if at the beginning of the war Churchill deemed the economic sacrifices of the war effort to be too great? And the psychological effects of the war too great for the people to bear. The UK would have lost WWII.

 

Actually, Chamberlain tried that in the mid 1930’s and they found appeasement did not work out all that well against an enemy like the 3rd Reich. It was a talented, motivated, relentless and vicious adversary. Fortunately the virus is a much lesser enemy.

 

Why Trump's call to restart the economy in April is being derided as 'totally nuts'

 

- https://finance.yahoo.com/news/why-trump-to-restart-the-economy-in-april-is-being-derided-as-totally-nuts-190129407.html

[Spekulatius]

Great resource about Coronavirus from Michael Lin:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ZaiDO87me4puBte-8VytcSRtpQ3PVpkK/view?usp=drivesdk

[jschembs]

If Trump said it was a 'hoax' to undermine his re-election chances... shouldn't we invert and suspect that Trump deliberately downplayed the threat to keep his re-election chances alive? 

 

1.  We know he was tipped off in Jan by US intelligence, and he now admits that he "knew it was a pandemic all along".

2.  The Washington Post reported yesterday that he is focusing on his re-election chances, and that coincides with him downplaying the threat again yesterday.

 

It doesn't look good for our collective chances if his first priority is himself.

 

Of course his first priority is himself. He's a narcissistic personality disorder and likely a sociopath. He doesn't care about reopening for "the economy" in general, he knows this current path doesn't lead him to get re-elected, and it's really bad for his hotels and resorts and his debt payments, and if he's out of power it's dangerous that he'll be investigated without pardon power, so he's ready to gamble it all and put all his chips on 15 black and spin the wheel in the hope that this other approach may be better for his election and businesses. He's been incredibly lucky all his life, born to wealth, getting away with all kinds of stuff, becoming president.. He's just gambling with lots of lives and the US healthcare system in the balance that his luck will hold.

 

And he didn't know back then. He's not intellectually capable to have understood the implications when it was still theoretical, and he's surrounded by yes-men and he fires or drives away anyone who's independent-minded pretty quickly. Can you even imagine him reading complex briefings and diving into the details? He thinks in cable-TV soundbytes. Listen to him talk about any of this and it's just a bunch of word-salad "it's great, going tremendous, big effort"... No real understanding. Even now as people are dying and hospitals are being quickly turned into disaster zones, he's not listening to the people who know what they're talking about, he's driving away Fauci and contradicting his task force on TV and picking petty fights with desperate governors who need federal help. He's likely never even spoke to anyone on the front lines of this and shows zero empathy for anyone dealing with this, only worry for himself veiled in language about "the economy" (which was how he always said he measured his presidency, always talking about stock market records, etc).

 

Wish I could say I thought any of this was "left-wing slander" (not implying you're left wing). Any links to the rift between he and Fauci?

 

edit - corrected my right from my left...

[Liberty]

 

So far, Cuomo says New York State has procured 7,000 ventilators, but anticipates needing 30,000.

 

 

 

And the rest of the country has the ventilators they need...  Bill Barr claims he will aggressively prosecute 'hoarding'.  Will he order hospitals with ventilators to share in order to save lives in NYC?

 

Yeah, but who's going to send their ventilators over and then not have enough later on if their area goes bad.. No politician wants that. It's a coordination problem. Ideally there's be a liquid market shipping ventilators around to where they are most needed, but right now, everybody wants to keep theirs. That's why the fed is supposed to be the coordinator and supplier of extra liquidity to the places that need it most.

 

But anway, ventilators are only part of the problem.. Need negative pressure rooms, ICU beds, AND the nurses and doctors who know how to operator them AND protect them with PPE so they don't all get sick and then you have a bunch of useless equipment and beds. And even if you keep them from getting sick with PPE, how long do you keep them from burning out if the case loads keeps increasing day after day for weeks?

 

FLATTEN THE CURVE, STAY HOME, and let's hope leaders start listening to people who know what they're talking about...We know what to do, others have done it, just have to explain it well to everybody and actually do it:

 

https://medium.com/@tomaspueyo/coronavirus-the-hammer-and-the-dance-be9337092b56

[james22]

Fuck off to the Politics section, would you?

 

This isn't politics. This is a public health issue, and not a theoretical one. The person in charge is incompetent to deal with it. If you want to pretend this is politics, fine, but it isn't. I don't care he's right or left, blue or red, purple or orange. if he was acting rationally and competently in the face of the COVID19 threat, I'd applaud, but he's not, so I'm explaining why I think that is.

 

Now stay civil or get out.

 

LOL

 

Let me know if you think this political:

 

1. Hillary's a narcissistic personality disorder and likely a sociopath.

 

2. Biden's not intellectually capable.

 

They were/are the Trump alternative.

 

 

Can we stick with criticizing the strategy and skip questioning the motivation?

[netnet]

In South Korea, the medical experts at the very beginning recommended the president to close the border with China. This didn't happen. It turns out, the major outbreak occurred because of a single superspreader in the religious sect who has never visited China.

https://www.businessinsider.com/church-cult-south-korea-coronavirus-outbreak-meetings-wuhan-december-2020-2?op=1

 

Uhh...what??

 

200 members of this cult were in Wuhan!

[Liberty]

Fuck off to the Politics section, would you?

 

This isn't politics. This is a public health issue, and not a theoretical one. The person in charge is incompetent to deal with it. If you want to pretend this is politics, fine, but it isn't. I don't care he's right or left, blue or red, purple or orange. if he was acting rationally and competently in the face of the COVID19 threat, I'd applaud, but he's not, so I'm explaining why I think that is.

 

Now stay civil or get out.

 

LOL

 

Let me know if you think this political:

 

1. Hillary's a narcissistic personality disorder and likely a sociopath.

 

2. Biden's not intellectually capable.

 

They were/are the Trump alternative.

 

 

Can we stick with criticizing the strategy and skip questioning the motivation?

 

Why are you wasting everyone's time trying to derail this thread with unrelated things?

 

By understanding how someone thinks and what motivates them, you can make predictions about what decisions they will make. Trump is currently the president. It's very important to understand how he thinks in this life or death situation with huge economic and institutional impacts on the US and the world. Those who pretend that he's a normal person have been wrong about him at every turn exactly because they don't realize how he thinks and what motivates him. Trying to pretend that others are just like Trump is bonkers on its face, especially others that we've seen hold office and we know what they're like (like them or not, that's fine, but they're nothing like Trump).

[netnet]

If Trump said it was a 'hoax' to undermine his re-election chances... shouldn't we invert and suspect that Trump deliberately downplayed the threat to keep his re-election chances alive? 

 

1.  We know he was tipped off in Jan by US intelligence, and he now admits that he "knew it was a pandemic all along".

2.  The Washington Post reported yesterday that he is focusing on his re-election chances, and that coincides with him downplaying the threat again yesterday.

 

It doesn't look good for our collective chances if his first priority is himself.

 

Of course his first priority is himself. He's a narcissistic personality disorder and likely a sociopath. He doesn't care about reopening for "the economy" in general, he knows this current path doesn't lead him to get re-elected, and it's really bad for his hotels and resorts and his debt payments, and if he's out of power it's dangerous that he'll be investigated without pardon power, so he's ready to gamble it all and put all his chips on 15 black and spin the wheel in the hope that this other approach may be better for his election and businesses. He's been incredibly lucky all his life, born to wealth, getting away with all kinds of stuff, becoming president.. He's just gambling with lots of lives and the US healthcare system in the balance that his luck will hold.

 

And he didn't know back then. He's not intellectually capable to have understood the implications when it was still theoretical, and he's surrounded by yes-men and he fires or drives away anyone who's independent-minded pretty quickly. Listen to him talk about any of this and it's just a bunch of word-salad "it's great, going tremendous, big effort"... No real understanding. Even now as people are dying and hospitals are being quickly turned into disaster zones, he's not listening to the people who know what they're talking about, he's driving away Fauci and contradicting his task force on TV and picking petty fights with desperate governors who need federal help. He's likely never even spoke to anyone on the front lines of this and shows zero empathy for anyone dealing with this, only worry for himself veiled in language about "the economy" (which was how he always said he measured his presidency, always talking about stock market records, etc).

 

"it's great, going tremendous, big effort"

 

More like "it's very very great, going tremendous, quite tremendously, big big effort.  very big.  so big you won't believe but it's there and I'm almost always right about these things."

 

You forgot the "...And who knew that epidemics could threaten the economy..."

[Spekulatius]

Fuck off to the Politics section, would you?

 

This isn't politics. This is a public health issue, and not a theoretical one. The person in charge is incompetent to deal with it. If you want to pretend this is politics, fine, but it isn't. I don't care he's right or left, blue or red, purple or orange. if he was acting rationally and competently in the face of the COVID19 threat, I'd applaud, but he's not, so I'm explaining why I think that is.

 

Now stay civil or get out.

 

LOL

 

Let me know if you think this political:

 

1. Hillary's a narcissistic personality disorder and likely a sociopath.

 

2. Biden's not intellectually capable.

 

They were/are the Trump alternative.

 

 

Can we stick with criticizing the strategy and skip questioning the motivation?

 

Why are you wasting everyone's time trying to derail this thread with unrelated things?

 

By understanding how someone thinks and what motivates them, you can make predictions about what decisions they will make. Trump is currently the president. It's very important to understand how he thinks in this life or death situation with huge economic and institutional impacts on the US and the world. Those who pretend that he's a normal person have been wrong about him at every turn exactly because they don't realize how he thinks and what motivates him.

 

I am pretty sure if it’s the choice is between his re-election and 500k dead, I know what he is going to pick. Telltale sign will be Fauci resigning.