leftcoast Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 A couple of questions: How low did the BAC "B" warrants trade last December? How high did they go for at the peak in March? http://bigcharts.marketwatch.com/kaavio.Webhost/charts/big.chart?nosettings=1&symb=bacwsb&uf=0&type=2&size=2&sid=4553784&style=320&freq=1&entitlementtoken=0c33378313484ba9b46b8e24ded87dd6&time=7&rand=679942293&compidx=&ma=0&maval=9&lf=1&lf2=0&lf3=0&height=335&width=579&mocktick=1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tombgrt Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 Here you go: http://www.investorpoint.com/stock/BAC.WS.A-BANK%20OF%20AMERICA%20WARRANTS/chart/?qm_page=25639 & http://www.investorpoint.com/stock/BAC%252EWS%252EB-BANK%20OF%20AMERICA%20CORPORATION%20WARRANTS/ Eric and others, what BAC options would you prefer if you had a fresh start now? I'm looking to change my bac common for jan 2014 7.5 and 10's. If I have to roll them over in November, so be it! I have cash coming in so I can handle extreme new bargains as well. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shane Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 Motley Fool Article- "So what's the problem? Investors have other choices that just plain look better. While Bank of America sells for 12.25 times 2012 earnings, you can buy Wells Fargo (NYSE: WFC) for about 10 times forward earnings. The fact that Wells pays a dividend of 2.64% versus Bank of America's 0.52%, is another factor that argues for buying Wells instead. There are other problems that Bank of America has to own." So instead of normalized earnings he uses a 1 or 2 year forward projection and compares it to WFC... Lost interest after reading that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parsad Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 Here you go: http://www.investorpoint.com/stock/BAC.WS.A-BANK%20OF%20AMERICA%20WARRANTS/chart/?qm_page=25639 & http://www.investorpoint.com/stock/BAC%252EWS%252EB-BANK%20OF%20AMERICA%20CORPORATION%20WARRANTS/ Eric and others, what BAC options would you prefer if you had a fresh start now? I'm looking to change my bac common for jan 2014 7.5 and 10's. If I have to roll them over in November, so be it! I have cash coming in so I can handle extreme new bargains as well. :) Our November $7 puts bought when BAC was just under $10 are up over 120% in a couple of months! We've sold a third. As we sell off the rest, we may get to buy more BAC at fantastic prices again. We bought the puts to protect the equity gains. Mr. Market is discounting a terrific bank executive and his reborn bank! Cheers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tombgrt Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 Good job Parsad. (Btw on the other topic: I totally agree with you as well. ;)) I've sold 1/4th of my position back then at 9,6ish only to buy something that has dropped as much as BAC since then. ;D I'm just as stunned by the current price as I was in December but am aware that things could always get nastier. However, I'm not counting on it and believe the risk/reward is here again to take a bet with the options. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sswan11 Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 A couple of questions: How low did the BAC "B" warrants trade last December? How high did they go for at the peak in March? According to ETrade low was .29 in December, high 1.15 in March at close on 3/16 (traded up to 1.21 intraday on 3/19 but closed at 1.08). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racemize Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 A couple of questions: How low did the BAC "B" warrants trade last December? How high did they go for at the peak in March? According to ETrade low was .29 in December, high 1.15 in March at close on 3/16 (traded up to 1.21 intraday on 3/19 but closed at 1.08). I'm having trouble getting behind the B warrants--they have a break over point that's way up there. It seems a little too speculative to me, so I'm sticking with A and common. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnson Posted May 17, 2012 Share Posted May 17, 2012 Hi All, Been reading the board for a while, but just recently joined. I went all in on BAC at 8.78. Been painful to see it come down, but hoping it hits 15 by 2014, but if it doesn't, I can still wait longer. For those of you in the warrants/leaps, in what timeframe do you think the litigation and legacy issues will be behind them? That, along with the macro environment, would determine the price in the near time frame (1-2 years). Regards, Johnson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parsad Posted May 18, 2012 Share Posted May 18, 2012 Hi All, Been reading the board for a while, but just recently joined. I went all in on BAC at 8.78. Been painful to see it come down, but hoping it hits 15 by 2014, but if it doesn't, I can still wait longer. For those of you in the warrants/leaps, in what timeframe do you think the litigation and legacy issues will be behind them? That, along with the macro environment, would determine the price in the near time frame (1-2 years). Regards, Johnson I suspect most of the litigation and legacy issues will be behind them after two years. As each quarter goes by, and their Tier 1 capital ratio increases while lawsuits fall by the wayside, the market price will slowly move towards tangible book and then book. It will depend heavily on how the U.S. recovers, especially housing, because a good portion of their engine is driven by loans and credit. Cheers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabbitisrich Posted May 18, 2012 Share Posted May 18, 2012 I really like Moynihan, and have to be careful not to put a halo around him. I have been adding aggressively recently. This volatility has been wonderful. The nice thing about the current price, and trends in collateral values, is that Moynihan doesn't have to be an amazing risk manager and revenue builder. He just has to stick to his stated principles and prioritize risk managers versus profit centers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERICOPOLY Posted May 18, 2012 Share Posted May 18, 2012 Here you go: http://www.investorpoint.com/stock/BAC.WS.A-BANK%20OF%20AMERICA%20WARRANTS/chart/?qm_page=25639 & http://www.investorpoint.com/stock/BAC%252EWS%252EB-BANK%20OF%20AMERICA%20CORPORATION%20WARRANTS/ Eric and others, what BAC options would you prefer if you had a fresh start now? I'm looking to change my bac common for jan 2014 7.5 and 10's. If I have to roll them over in November, so be it! I have cash coming in so I can handle extreme new bargains as well. :) I dropped all my leverage when the stock was in the upper $9 range, and wrote some 2014 $15 strike calls for 82 cents. I bought the calls back in when they were down as the price fell 50%. Today, I bought a big chunk of common, and my leverage comes via the $5 and $7 2014 calls. In order to keep the volatility decay from being a drag on my returns, I put a small amount into the 2014 $10 calls that I sold $12 calls against. So if the stock is over $12 at expiry, the small amount tied up in that bull spread will gain about 6x (enough to pay for the current options premium embedded in my calls, plus an extra gain to just enjoy). Then I also have some $10 strike 2014 calls for speculation, but only about 3% of portfolio. I'll roll them into 2015 calls when available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enoch01 Posted May 18, 2012 Share Posted May 18, 2012 I really like Moynihan, and have to be careful not to put a halo around him. I have been adding aggressively recently. This volatility has been wonderful. The nice thing about the current price, and trends in collateral values, is that Moynihan doesn't have to be an amazing risk manager and revenue builder. He just has to stick to his stated principles and prioritize risk managers versus profit centers. That's part of why I admire him - focus. He's a great fit for this job, at this bank, in this environment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parsad Posted May 18, 2012 Share Posted May 18, 2012 I really like Moynihan, and have to be careful not to put a halo around him. I have been adding aggressively recently. This volatility has been wonderful. The nice thing about the current price, and trends in collateral values, is that Moynihan doesn't have to be an amazing risk manager and revenue builder. He just has to stick to his stated principles and prioritize risk managers versus profit centers. That's part of why I admire him - focus. He's a great fit for this job, at this bank, in this environment. Yes! He would have been an odd duck six years ago when executives were going nuts. I think if anyone had doubts about Moynihan, he's acquitted himself nicely. This is a meat and potatoes guy, and what he's done so far has been extraordinary. Cheers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERICOPOLY Posted May 18, 2012 Share Posted May 18, 2012 Once again the volume was below average (only slightly today). The other large peers (WFC/C/JPM) have trading volumes far in excess of normal. What's the significance of being a relatively low volume stock in a market full of high volume? Not many sellers, a big buyer trying to accumulate? Yes, I figure this is insignificant to most of you, but I'm interested in knowing why my dog is exhibiting strange behavior. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kmukul Posted May 18, 2012 Share Posted May 18, 2012 Well once there was a link posted which was talking about the fact that bac is very highly traded in using automated trading due to the fact price is low, may be there is a cut back to that kind of trading as market is "risky" now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twacowfca Posted May 18, 2012 Share Posted May 18, 2012 Once again the volume was below average (only slightly today). The other large peers (WFC/C/JPM) have trading volumes far in excess of normal. What's the significance of being a relatively low volume stock in a market full of high volume? Not many sellers, a big buyer trying to accumulate? Yes, I figure this is insignificant to most of you, but I'm interested in knowing why my dog is exhibiting strange behavior. When a value stock (low P/B) drops a lot and then forms a bottom on relatively low volume for an extended time, it typically will gradually rise. However, a brief decline in volume may not necessarily be such a strong signal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlanMaestro Posted May 18, 2012 Share Posted May 18, 2012 Valueline http://www3.valueline.com/dow30/f6291.pdf 2006 2011 4458 10536 Shares Outstanding 1459 2129 Assets $B 327.3 202.0 Assets/share 29.7 20.4 BV/share 9.3% 10.8% Leverage 1.45% 0.1% ROA [41-55] 7.0 Price per share Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERICOPOLY Posted May 18, 2012 Share Posted May 18, 2012 Valueline http://www3.valueline.com/dow30/f6291.pdf 2006 2011 4458 10536 Shares Outstanding 1459 2129 Assets $B 327.3 202.0 Assets/share 29.7 20.4 BV/share 9.3% 10.8% Leverage 1.45% 0.1% ROA [41-55] 7.0 Price per share The ROA figure is a bit strange. For the pre-crisis years BofA had much better ROA than JPM, yet people think JPM is some kind of best in breed and that BAC is garbage. Why was BAC's precrisis ROA so much better than JPMs? The BAC-originated stuff fared rather well in the crisis, so I don't think we can blame it on reaching for yield. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlanMaestro Posted May 18, 2012 Share Posted May 18, 2012 The ROA figure is a bit strange. For the pre-crisis years BofA had much better ROA than JPM, yet people think JPM is some kind of best in breed and that BAC is garbage. Why was BAC's precrisis ROA so much better than JPMs? The BAC-originated stuff fared rather well in the crisis, so I don't think we can blame it on reaching for yield. Bank of America was a better retail bank at that time. It has a very low cost deposit franchise, one of the best in the country. The problem was its management history of bad acquisitions (explosion of shares outstanding 2006-2011). JP Morgan's reputation was built on Dimon's operational improvement, but from a very low base must be said, and how they navigated the crisis. Now including WAMU's branch network things have improved but still not at the same level as Bank of America's franchise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlanMaestro Posted May 18, 2012 Share Posted May 18, 2012 A sample from BankRegData but must be checked, Cost of Funding Zions Bancorporation 0.24% Wells Fargo 0.35% Fifth Third 0.36% Bank of America 0.37% PNC Bank 0.43% M&T Bank Corp. 0.43% JP Morgan 0.46% SunTrust Bank 0.52% Regions Bank 0.52% KeyBank 0.56% U.S. Bancorp 0.67% BB&T 0.70% Capital One 0.89% Citigroup 0.94% Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmichaud Posted May 18, 2012 Share Posted May 18, 2012 Eric, you must like the support BAC is seeing today in a HIDEOUS market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERICOPOLY Posted May 18, 2012 Share Posted May 18, 2012 Eric, you must like the support BAC is seeing today in a HIDEOUS market. Yup! BAC: +0.57% (on only 80% of average volume) Other banks: JPM: -1.30% (2x average volume) WFC: -1.58% (1.6x average volume) C: -1.51% (1.5x average volume) USB: -1.24% (1.3x average volume) Index ETFs: IWM Russel 2000: -1.1% SPY S&P500 -.86% DIA DJIA -1.01% Others: FRFHF.PK: -.73% BRK.B: -1.16% Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlanMaestro Posted May 18, 2012 Share Posted May 18, 2012 Yup! Nope! Another $5/$2 common/warrants please! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERICOPOLY Posted May 18, 2012 Share Posted May 18, 2012 Yup! Nope! Another $5/$2 common/warrants please! I would rather you wish for something else, like the $10 per share for AXP (March 2009 price). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PlanMaestro Posted May 18, 2012 Share Posted May 18, 2012 I would rather you wish for something else, like the $10 per share for AXP (March 2009 price). Now that you make me think about it, you are right. Yup! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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