Smazz Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 They did mention the QNX developers phones are complete and working Id think they dont want to say anything that would steer buyers away from what they have left to sell before those phones come on board. Its a tricky situation - another reason why many of us knew this would be a tread water qtr or 2 at best. No real surprises. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smazz Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Do people like RIMM more because it's a large canadian company and this is a canadian board? Just curious. I'm in the U.S and in it strictly for a turnaround play. The media here in the states can be very relentless when a company is in transition. Some of it bordered on embarrassing for the media. Remember Jaguar whatevers? I believe it was marketwatch - came out with a clip on how Jaguar says RIM should be doing this and that and then they asked each other "has anyone ever heard about these Jaguar people?" Everyone to a man agreed that they were truley unknowns with no stake of any consequence in the game - yet continued on with repeating what these Jaguar people felt should be done. hahaa.. what a joke. Thats like us making our investment decisions on what this PeterBurke guy writes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josh4580 Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Mr. Peter Burke CEO, to be fair, Mr. Balsillie owns 26.7 million shares worth $640 million after hours and Mr. Lazaridis owns 26.5 million shares worth $636 million for a total of $1.27 billion of CEO ownership. I would think that aligns their interests with stock holders. However maybe they aren't picking up more shares because they are astute value investors that are waiting for 2.5 p/e versus the absurdly high current p/e of 5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CONeal Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Gross margin guidance continues to be lowered... And I'm still waiting for a credible responses to an argument I made months ago: What's more (and I have made this same argument before in this forum, too), RIM takes home ~40% of sales as gross margin vs. ~20% of other handset makers. Why? BIS/BES. Now, flip it around and put on the thinking hat of a corporate decision maker. These services are NOT free. When your userbase is no longer dominated by BBs, why would you NOT shop around for mobile security solutions (such as http://bit.ly/oKnpXx) or, even in the case of large multinationals, do it in house? Oh, and by the way the RIM earns significantly lower margin (as a % of sales) on the Playbook than traditional BBs. Sales growth (especially in international markets, where customer behavior will eventually catch up with the early smartphone markets such as the US and prefer more internet-browsing-friendly phones) will also decelerate. 1 + 1 + 1 = 3, please enlighten me how RIMM margin will NOT go down? Margins will go down a little as the Playbook is being used as a device to make sure RIM is positioned in the tablet wars. They will be able to sell servers and BES licenses for the connection to the Playbook. The margins for the phones fell a little this qtr as they were clearing out inventory for BB7 has the traditional margins that their phones normally. Regarding multinationals bringing it in house. Is it really cost effective to do this? The extra workers you have to hire and pay salary and benefits to? The hassle of bringing it inhouse when you already ave a solution that works well. Security in these companies are very strict and the couple of extra dollars that might (and I really mean might) be saved is really not worth the effort. This might sound kind of weird but this is how a particular company actually looks at it. They are anal retentive to the 10th degree when it comes to security. Asked them if they have tested the IPhone or Andriod for use? Yes, it was tested bc management asked them. They won't be supporting other phones for several reasons. Might not answer your question but that is the best I can do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uccmal Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 I think people underestimate the CEOs, especially Lazaridis. He is on par with Steve Jobs in determination and skill. I listened to the conference call last night and was very impressed with their marketing plans. They seem to have drunk the Koolaid of the marketing game. We shall see. My downside at this point is non-existent. My upside if the stock returns to its highs of just last year would make this the biggest hit of all time for me. We shall see. As to Canadian bias, I am sure it exists. I take it from the perspective that we are closer to the source and perhaps are more aware of the goings on. Hometown advantage? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ballinvarosig Investors Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Margins will go down a little as the Playbook is being used as a device to make sure RIM is positioned in the tablet wars. They will be able to sell servers and BES licenses for the connection to the Playbook. The margins for the phones fell a little this qtr as they were clearing out inventory for BB7 has the traditional margins that their phones normally.If this was a real war, it would be WW2 and the Playbook would be Germany, in a bunker in Berlin in 1945 with Russian tanks just down the street. I am surprised at how easily people are just glossing over these awful, awful numbers. But hey, who cares about making dough, the CEO is a genius and they have a wonderful market campaign :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCG Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 I think people underestimate the CEOs, especially Lazaridis. He is on par with Steve Jobs in determination and skill. I listened to the conference call last night and was very impressed with their marketing plans. They seem to have drunk the Koolaid of the marketing game. We shall see. Comparing Lazaridis to Steve Jobs is comical. RIMM's ceo's are delusional. They actually said on the conference call yesterday that people aren't buying Blackberrys because they're holding out for the new Blackberrys coming out next year. People are not buying blackberrys because they are waiting for the new iPhone, not new Blackberrys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liberty Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Stock down 23% right now. Good opportunity for the RIM bulls to load up, I suppose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uccmal Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Nearly 10 percent of float trading this morning. That's alot of idiots buying at the new low price. I guess those new buyers didn't read all the garbage analysis out there. Enough said by me for this year on this topic. Time will tell the tale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rijk Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 the extreme negative sentiment + the fact that hwic has tripled their position in Q2 make this an interesting investment candidate has hwic made public statements regarding their rimm investmens case? http://www.forbes.com/sites/ericsavitz/2011/09/16/bury-the-berry-rimm-shares-crushed-on-weak-demand/?partner=yahootix Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smazz Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Comparing Lazaridis to Steve Jobs is comical. Good pt. Lazaridis didnt spend 20+ years trying to get people to use MACs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liberty Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Good pt. Lazaridis didnt spend 20+ years trying to get people to use MACs. :o Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smazz Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Good pt. Lazaridis didnt spend 20+ years trying to get people to use MACs. :o nothing personal Liberty ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
given2invest Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Nearly 10 percent of float trading this morning. That's alot of idiots buying at the new low price. I guess those new buyers didn't read all the garbage analysis out there. Enough said by me for this year on this topic. Time will tell the tale. Same number of people own RIMM that owned it yesterday, just different people that's all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tombgrt Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Nearly 10 percent of float trading this morning. That's alot of idiots buying at the new low price. I guess those new buyers didn't read all the garbage analysis out there. Enough said by me for this year on this topic. Time will tell the tale. Same number of people own RIMM that owned it yesterday, just different people that's all. Same number of owners? Small chance. :P (jk, know what you mean ;) ) Maybe some people should just acknowledge that RIMM's case could be to hard to crack for them. I wouldn't have the balls to go against someone like Prem, neither would I feel very condifent owning this long. I'll let others play with more skill in the game as I have no idea how asymmetric the risk/reward is. (if of course, that is the case...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Hester Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Nearly 10 percent of float trading this morning. That's alot of idiots buying at the new low price. I guess those new buyers didn't read all the garbage analysis out there. wtf?!?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubuy2wron Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Nearly 10 percent of float trading this morning. That's alot of idiots buying at the new low price. I guess those new buyers didn't read all the garbage analysis out there. wtf?!?! I have no dog in this fight and I am not likely to. I did watch three stooges lead by Mr Cramer that paragon of ethics do a complete hatchet job before the opening on the company describing management as delusional stating that all the company could do at this stage was dismantle itself, that it was doomed etc. etc. It was so blatant I was tempted to buy some on the opening and it looks like that would have worked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tombgrt Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 Nearly 10 percent of float trading this morning. That's alot of idiots buying at the new low price. I guess those new buyers didn't read all the garbage analysis out there. wtf?!?! I believe he was being sarcastic. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smazz Posted September 16, 2011 Share Posted September 16, 2011 I did watch three stooges lead by Mr Cramer that paragon of ethics haha.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ericd1 Posted September 19, 2011 Share Posted September 19, 2011 I found this article interesting... Dirt Cheap PlayBook May Mean A Tablet Price War Is Coming Talks about how RIM can't dump its tablet like HP did because of the operating system. Although I'm not sure why not, except for the helping to fine tune next years phones operating system. They may have to significantly lower prices to keep selling them. http://www.forbes.com/sites/briancaulfield/2011/09/17/dirt-cheap-playbook-may-mean-a-tablet-price-war-is-coming/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liberty Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-09-20/rim-u-s-sales-cut-in-half-last-quarter-as-consumers-defect-to-iphones.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairfaxnut Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 What's hidden in RIM's numbers is the fact that 35% of the 13.7 MILLION phones sold this quarter were the new BB7 devices that were only available two weeks prior to quarter end. Hey folks this equates to 4.795 million BB7 phones sold in two weeks! Rim seems to be offering the PB at a discount to retailers that have salesman than tend to hype the android and apple stuff. So if these employees actually try and buy the PB (at the employee discount), they may be surprised and actually recommend the product in the store to new customers....smart move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tombgrt Posted September 20, 2011 Share Posted September 20, 2011 Interesting find. But can you extend those numbers to the coming quarters? Maybe it's just the initial rush that takes 1-2 months after which sales go down again? What about the fact that RIMM's portables mainly focus on buttons? Doesn't this secure them of a customer base with preference for buttons instead of a full touch screen? I know plenty of people that prefer buttons over a touch screen, especially when their budget doesn't allow them to buy the latest Iphone or high end android. Maybe there is room for more players than we would think. I am probably saying things that have been said a hunderd times before but oke... Just ignore the above if that is the case. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest valueInv Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 Research In Motion Ltd. (RIMM)’s sales in the U.S. fell by 50 percent last quarter, dragging total revenue lower, as American consumers abandoned older BlackBerry phone models for Apple Inc. (AAPL)’s iPhones. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-09-20/rim-u-s-sales-cut-in-half-last-quarter-as-consumers-defect-to-iphones.html Wow, thats a lot. ??? That's even before the iPhone 5 has launched. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerbaron Posted September 21, 2011 Share Posted September 21, 2011 What's hidden in RIM's numbers is the fact that 35% of the 13.7 MILLION phones sold this quarter were the new BB7 devices that were only available two weeks prior to quarter end. Hey folks this equates to 4.795 million BB7 phones sold in two weeks! Rim seems to be offering the PB at a discount to retailers that have salesman than tend to hype the android and apple stuff. So if these employees actually try and buy the PB (at the employee discount), they may be surprised and actually recommend the product in the store to new customers....smart move. Where did you find this information? BeerBaron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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