AAPL - Apple Inc.

[DCG]

I used to have an Android phone and Google Maps' turn by turn directions are also pretty awful, for what it's worth.

[Guest rimm_never_sleeps]

I see some tech bloggers are starting to turn on apple over this maps issue. lots of them don't think ios6 offers anything new. the tech bloggers are the canary in the coal mine. this maps thing is a big deal. nav is an important application for them. supposedly it's awful in urban areas. not saying apple is jumping the shark. but this is something to monitor. the tech bloggers are going to move to wp8 and android. apple is not cool for them any more. it's still cool for the masses. but the tech bloggers generally are out in front of trends.

[txlaw]

I've played around with the new maps, and one thing I like is the integration of Yelp reviews.

[DCG]

the tech bloggers are going to move to wp8 and android. apple is not cool for them any more. it's still cool for the masses. but the tech bloggers generally are out in front of trends.

 

What?? You're making this assumption based on the maps app?

 

The complaints are overblown. Google Maps on iOS has been neglected for a while. Google will release a new iOS app and the competition should make both companies try harder.  I like what I've seen from the Apple maps app in the brief time I've used it so far.

[Guest valueInv]

Location is a key strategic piece of the phone. It is used everywhere Passbook, Siri, etc. I think Apple didn't want to be dependent on an outside company for such an important piece. Hence, the move. Notice, they didn't move to Nokia/Bing maps but are rolling out their own.

 

The thing about maps/location data is that a lot of it comes from usage i.e. they are collecting data from you as you use it. Apple was providing Google a ton of location data. Going forward, Apple will own that data and use it to improve its own mapping application. Over the long term, expect Apple's maps to get better and even surpass Google's maps - maps usage is likely to be higher on iPhones Vs Androids.

 

Short term - this is Tim Cook's first crisis test. It'll be interesting to watch how he responds. My guess is you won't hear from them until they get to the bottom of this. The possibilities are:

 

Its an algorithm problem: This is likely to be fixed quickly

Its a data problem: How quickly it gets fixed depends on how quickly Apple can incorporate location data it collects from users

Its both: My guess is this. You are likely to see a significant improvement over the short term with Google-catchup over the long term.

 

I upgraded to IOS 6 yesterday and played with maps a bit, I looked at my home and it worked pretty well - I could see the deck chairs on my roof. I like some of the features it has such as flyover.

 

The question is - Apple knew they had a problem and they would take a hit. Why did they not push back the release or call it a beta? How quickly can they fix it?

[DCG]

It's not a crisis (& is not anywhere near the antenna issue). Aside from bloggers looking for a story, everyone I've talked to (and on other forums) has said the app works well so far.

[Guest valueInv]

It's not a crisis (& is not anywhere near the antenna issue). Aside from bloggers looking for a story, everyone I've talked to (and on other forums) has said the app works well so far.

 

It's a crisis in terms of perception. Antenna gate itself turned out to be not a huge issue in the end. In reality, there are plenty of apps out there to fill in while Apple fixes its own app. However, every blogger out there knows Apple-bashing drives traffic, expect them to take full advantage of this.

 

Apple invests a lot in its brand, so something like this is a big cost for them.

[Guest valueInv]

So for folks comparing features between IOS and Android, compare this:

 

http://techcrunch.com/2012/09/20/chartboost-15-ios-6-adoption-rate-confirmed-highest-among-iphone-owners-at-17-in-24-hours/

http://developer.android.com/about/dashboards/index.html

 

ICS is what, a almost year old now?

[Guest rimm_never_sleeps]

I wonder if google might neglect ios mapping in order to drive people to Android. and yes this is a big deal. Apple is making some awful decisions lately. the bloggers also hate the new charging port.  more apple lock in. they don't think ios6 adds much value.  I said this was a canary in the coal mine. the unwashed masses who get the message late will still wait in line for this. but I am detecting a shift.

[txlaw]

It's not a crisis (& is not anywhere near the antenna issue). Aside from bloggers looking for a story, everyone I've talked to (and on other forums) has said the app works well so far.

 

It's a crisis in terms of perception. Antenna gate itself turned out to be not a huge issue in the end. In reality, there are plenty of apps out there to fill in while Apple fixes its own app. However, every blogger out there knows Apple-bashing drives traffic, expect them to take full advantage of this.

 

Apple invests a lot in its brand, so something like this is a big cost for them.

 

Apple bashing drives traffic?  Fanboyism drives just as much, if not more, traffic.

 

It's not a crisis.  However, you guys are fooling yourselves if you think the app is as good as Google Maps.  For anyone who is a bit savvy, not having the functionality of Google Maps is actually a big negative.  I will not upgrade to iOS 6 on my iPhone 4 because I want to keep on using Google Maps on it.  I did, however, upgrade my iPad to iOS 6.

 

This is not to say that Apple users won't get used to an inferior mapping product or personal assistant (Siri) or calendar or whatever.  I think the strength of the Apple brand means that they could very well get used to the inferior Apple version.

[DCG]

You guys are talking about this like the app is set in stone and Apple will never make improvements to it.

 

 

[DCG]

I wonder if google might neglect ios mapping in order to drive people to Android. and yes this is a big deal. Apple is making some awful decisions lately. the bloggers also hate the new charging port.  more apple lock in. they don't think ios6 adds much value.  I said this was a canary in the coal mine. the unwashed masses who get the message late will still wait in line for this. but I am detecting a shift.

 

What awful decisions have they made? And this is coming from someone with a handle named after RIMM, a company that has ran themselves into the ground?

 

Have you actually used the app?

[Guest rimm_never_sleeps]

i don't use the app. but I know that others don't like it. apple screwed up here. I like apple products. I don't like being locked into their ecosystem. more and more lock in is what I am seeing out of them.

[txlaw]

You guys are talking about this like the app is set in stone and Apple will never make improvements to it.

 

Not at all.  Just pointing out some current deficiencies that could potentially make me switch to Android or even Windows in the near term.  Apple fans are more than willing to point out what they believe are deficiencies in Android that could easily be fixed going forward.

 

It's a good idea to be objective about these things, no?  Especially if we're trying to figure out what the innovation gap is between Apple and the Others.

[gokou3]

Just for laughs:

 

http://theamazingios6maps.tumblr.com/

[kevin4u2]

I wonder if google might neglect ios mapping in order to drive people to Android. and yes this is a big deal. Apple is making some awful decisions lately. the bloggers also hate the new charging port.  more apple lock in. they don't think ios6 adds much value.  I said this was a canary in the coal mine. the unwashed masses who get the message late will still wait in line for this. but I am detecting a shift.

 

What awful decisions have they made? And this is coming from someone with a handle named after RIMM, a company that has ran themselves into the ground?

 

Have you actually used the app?

 

DCG you seem pretty emotionally involved here?  Do you work for Apple?

[bathtime]

From the Arstechnica review of iOs 6:

 

http://arstechnica.com/apple/2012/09/review-ios-6-gets-the-spit-and-polish-treatment/

 

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What's not in the new Maps is public transit directions. Google's API wasn't perfect, but transit directions were supported in many cities. As a city dweller who drives little, 9.9 out of every 10 times I use Maps is for public transit (transfer here, get off there)—not just in my own city, but whenever I'm traveling. I have virtually no reason to use Maps otherwise in my daily life, which is why its sudden absence in iOS 6 is deeply disappointing.

 

The button with a bus icon remains when you try to get directions—that's because Apple says it is opening up transit directions to third parties. At this writing, no apps were available to test the system, though some are in development. During the time I tested iOS 6, I ended up using Google Maps' mobile site in order to get from point A to point B via public transit—it works, but it's not the most enjoyable mobile experience (you have to re-enter your request for directions every time you leave and come back to Safari; under the old Maps, it would remember these parameters when you came back to the app).

 

I have confidence that some third-party developers will deliver on the transit end—at least here in Chicago, where I know some of them personally. But this may not be the case in every city, and not every app may be good or usable. One thing's for sure: the experience between cities won't be consistent. This is why I'm concerned about the usability of Maps in the long term; I think Apple risked alienating a huge chunk of the world's iOS-using population by going this route, but I keep my fingers crossed that it will work out in the end—or that Google will release its own Maps app for iOS, one that works more smoothly than its mobile site.

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[DCG]

I wonder if google might neglect ios mapping in order to drive people to Android. and yes this is a big deal. Apple is making some awful decisions lately. the bloggers also hate the new charging port.  more apple lock in. they don't think ios6 adds much value.  I said this was a canary in the coal mine. the unwashed masses who get the message late will still wait in line for this. but I am detecting a shift.

 

What awful decisions have they made? And this is coming from someone with a handle named after RIMM, a company that has ran themselves into the ground?

 

Have you actually used the app?

 

DCG you seem pretty emotionally involved here?  Do you work for Apple?

 

No. In not emotionally involved..just trying to put some of the recent comments on here in perspective.

[bathtime]

Maybe Apple will fall on its face one day because of a kind of bureaucratic arrogance. (Note, I'm typing this on a Macbook Air, which I love).

 

I bought my parents an iMac four years ago for Christmas - their first computer. A couple of years in the screen started failing, a vertical line appeared on the display and grew wider over time - making it difficult to use. My parents only had the one year warranty. In the spring of 2011 they took it into get checked out by a Genius at an Apple store. He said the only fix would be to replace the screen for $500.

 

It continued to get worse and in the fall of 2011 I happened to research display failure on their particular model. Turned out that other people had the same problem and Apple had internally flagged specific iMacs in that model as eligible for a free display replacement. But they didn't notify customers of this. And they only permitted free replacement displays for a limited period of time under this new policy (for six months or a year, I forget).

 

I got in touch with customer service by phone, explained the story and they confirmed my parents model/serial number matched that eligible for replacement and the rep told my parents to take it to a Genius, though he couldn't assure me that they would get a free replacement. They took it to a Genius, explained the issue, and were told it would be $500 because the replacement policy had expired.

 

So my parents were no longer eligible for this free replacement, even though they had taken it in to a Genius during the replacement period - simply because the Genius at that time wasn't aware of the replacement policy. My guess is that the replacement policy was buried deep in Apple customer service in Cupertino, and only offered to customers who requested it  - ones who likely discovered that option from doing extensive research on web forums. I call that bad customer service.

 

On the new Macbook Pro w/ Retina display, the premium line laptop, some are having problems with ghosting/burn-in on the displays manufactured by LG (but apparently not Samsung) - see this thread, for example, with 3400 replies since June.

 

https://discussions.apple.com/thread/4034848?start=0&tstart=0

 

http://www.macrumors.com/2012/09/17/retina-macbook-pro-users-still-complaining-of-image-persistence/

 

After replacing laptops for people who have raised concerns, Apple is now saying that this is normal behavior for the display. I don't know if that will effect the exchange policy. So if you're going to pick up the expensive Apple laptop, make sure you get one with the Samsung built display. This kind of customer service attitude can be very frustrating for customers, and it doesn't match the benevolent image that Apple markets itself as having.

 

[DCG]

bugs aside, the 3d city view in the Maps app is really cool, especially on an iPad. Go to a city like San Francisco or NYC and zoom far in, and click the city button. It does take some time to load, but some of the images are cool to look at.

[Palantir]

Those who are saying Apple could fail badly, what scenarios lead you into thinking that? Is it because you feel they will stop making good products, or that people will stop liking them? To me it does not seem that Apple's valuation show excessive growth expectations.

 

 

If anything, I feel that they have a lot of room to grow in the PC/tablet market.

[Guest valueInv]

I forgot this little detail - The iPhone 4s was outselling all LTE smartphones combined at Verizon:

 

http://www.roughlydrafted.com/2012/09/13/bored-by-iphone-5-careful-you-might-get-what-youre-asking-for/

 

 

How is that for specs?

[bathtime]

http://dashes.com/anil/2012/09/who-benefits-from-ios6s-crappy-maps.html

 

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Apple made this maps change despite its shortcomings because they put their own priorities for corporate strategy ahead of user experience. That's a huge change for Apple in the post-iPod era, where they've built so much of their value by doing the hard work as a company so that things could be easy for users. I'm not suggesting (yet) that this is a pattern, and that Apple will start to regularly compromise its user experiences in order to focus on its squabbles with other tech titans. But history shows that dominant players in every era of operating system history have reached a turning point where they shift from the user experience and customer benefits which earned them their dominance to platform integration efforts which are primarily aimed at boxing out competitors. It'll be interesting to see which direction Apple's maps follow.

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[rmitz]

http://dashes.com/anil/2012/09/who-benefits-from-ios6s-crappy-maps.html

 

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Apple made this maps change despite its shortcomings because they put their own priorities for corporate strategy ahead of user experience. That's a huge change for Apple in the post-iPod era, where they've built so much of their value by doing the hard work as a company so that things could be easy for users. I'm not suggesting (yet) that this is a pattern, and that Apple will start to regularly compromise its user experiences in order to focus on its squabbles with other tech titans. But history shows that dominant players in every era of operating system history have reached a turning point where they shift from the user experience and customer benefits which earned them their dominance to platform integration efforts which are primarily aimed at boxing out competitors. It'll be interesting to see which direction Apple's maps follow.

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So, I've actually used the maps function and it seems like a vast improvement to me.  I'll take it.  The google maps app was left to rust by google, the apple one will be enhanced; it's just a matter of tradeoffs in terms of which features to work on first.

 

Also, all this yelling seems a lot to me like people complaining about not having a floppy drive in the original iMac.  Anyone remember that?

[Guest valueInv]

Apple made this maps change despite its shortcomings because they put their own priorities for corporate strategy ahead of user experience.

 

In the short term yes, over the long term they they will probably produce a better user experience that Google. Already, the satellite/3D view is much better than Google's.

 

But history shows that dominant players in every era of operating system history have reached a turning point where they shift from the user experience and customer benefits which earned them their dominance to platform integration efforts which are primarily aimed at boxing out competitors.

The one company that does that comes to mind is Google. I don't think MSFT ever had a focus on user experience. In fact, they did a reverse shift - they went from not caring to actually innovating in user experience in Windows 8 (Finally!)