CLWR - Clearwire

[S2S]

Let's just say that ever since I started digging into this thing, Lightsquared never inspired much of my confidence.

 

...

Is Lightsquared the next Solyndra?

 

You're a wise man.  ;D

 

I only mentioned Lightsquared because the CLWR bulls on here love to gloat about the (inevitable IMHO) demise of Lightsquared due to the aforementioned GPS inteference and funding issues. No disagreement here... so what? Their thesis seems to be that if L2 is doomed, CLWR would become the only viable partner for Sprint and any other aspiring 4G players.

 

Not really. T-Mobile US, the MSOs and now even DISH all have plenty of spectrum assets to spare. Not only that, their spectrum is superior (okay, that's an opinion, not a fact) to CLWR's. The rare commodity nowadays is not spectrum, it's good old cash. Too many brides and not enough gold tooth barons to go around.

[bmichaud]

Let's not forget to mention the global 2.5 ghz initiative by Clearwire & China Mobile as confirmed by yesterday's announcement:

 

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/china-mobile-and-clearwire-announce-collaboration-on-td-lte-devices-2011-09-14-15000

 

Not quite sure how this type of investment aligns with Mr. Long's "bot" strategy...maybe we should ask him....

 

My bad on this post - didn't see you guys were already discussing the China Mobile announcement prior to brker guy's last post.

[Cardboard]

Any hope left for Clearwire?

 

Looks to me now that they will run out of cash without Sprint wanting to invest in the business. They need $1 billion and then Sprint wants to discontinue their phones meaning huge impact on future revenues/profits. Selling spectrum assets when you are in a distressed state is not a good place at the bargaining table. I am not sure what would be left for shareholders in a bankruptcy or liquidation. The assets are worthwhile, it is just a question about the demand at that time for the spectrum. How hungry are the players?

 

This whole story is crazy. Sprint is partnering and relying on LightSquared which could essentially be busted. Many reports indicate that their technology will be slow if they are forced to implement the proper GPS counter-interference devices, if they really exist!

 

I think that the best alternative is for CLWR to find an investor to support the company upgrading to LTE, then to sell itself to Verizon. This would result in obtaining a good price for the assets. Another good one is for Dish network to show up and create a really fast network with lots of capacity. In any case, I hope that Sprint will be destroyed once LS 4G LTE turns into a very slow technology or if it is completely shut down. Hesse is such a moron it is unbelievable.

 

Cardboard

[bmichaud]

Any hope left for Clearwire?

 

Looks to me now that they will run out of cash without Sprint wanting to invest in the business. They need $1 billion and then Sprint wants to discontinue their phones meaning huge impact on future revenues/profits. Selling spectrum assets when you are in a distressed state is not a good place at the bargaining table. I am not sure what would be left for shareholders in a bankruptcy or liquidation. The assets are worthwhile, it is just a question about the demand at that time for the spectrum. How hungry are the players?

 

This whole story is crazy. Sprint is partnering and relying on LightSquared which could essentially be busted. Many reports indicate that their technology will be slow if they are forced to implement the proper GPS counter-interference devices, if they really exist!

 

I think that the best alternative is for CLWR to find an investor to support the company upgrading to LTE, then to sell itself to Verizon. This would result in obtaining a good price for the assets. Another good one is for Dish network to show up and create a really fast network with lots of capacity. In any case, I hope that Sprint will be destroyed once LS 4G LTE turns into a very slow technology or if it is completely shut down. Hesse is such a moron it is unbelievable.

 

Cardboard

 

Two things IMO don't add up here....

 

1. Chairman John Stanton put $5MM into CLWR at around $1.80 back in August.

2. Sprint is about to buy a CRAZY amount of iPhones, which we all know gobble up data.

3. CLWR, at least according to CFO Hope Cochran, has ample access to vendor financing.

 

My answers:

 

1) Stanton is not a moron - he's bought and sold two wireless operators and is quoted as saying CLWR will be the easiest trade of his life, given that it has the best balance sheet as this point in a telecom start-up's life.

2) Sprint does not have the capacity to bring all 4G subs from CLWR's network over to its own AND add many more subs in order to fulfill the 30MM iPhone purchase obligation - it is rolling out a 5X5 network!!! CLWR's will be 20X20!!!

3) Perhaps Cochran is naive and just blindly believes they can obtain vendor financing - somehow I think LTE vendors will be all over a huge LTE rollout.

[CONeal]

Haven't had a chance to review anything today but did see this.

 

 

However, according to a report from Jennifer Fritzsche of Wells Fargo, who is following Sprint’s analyst event, Sprint said that it plans to move to a different networking standard, “LTE,” and that it will use its own spectrum first and foremost, and only then turn to either LightSquared, a privately held company with spectrum of its own, or Clearwire on a wholesale basis.

 

 

As much as Sprint has invested in Clearwire it would be crazy for them to just walk away.  Allowing them to go into bankruptcy does not guarantee they can pick the assets up on the cheap.

 

Get the feeling that today's announce is a little posturing from Sprint to get a better deal off the ATT/Tmobile merger.

 

 

[bathtime]

bmichaud,

 

Thanks for your analysis, do you have a link or more info on when Stanton said it would be an easy trade.

 

Thanks!

[bmichaud]

bmichaud,

 

Thanks for your analysis, do you have a link or more info on when Stanton said it would be an easy trade.

 

Thanks!

 

Second paragraph down on page 7 of the PDF. I apologize, doesn't say "easy trade" - I remember reading that from an analyst report I believe....

Clearwire_Corporation_Q2_2011_Earnings_Call_Aug_03_20111.pdf

[Cardboard]

"There was a lady in the audience today during the presentation, why spend $10 billion when you can spend $600 mm with your subsidiary CLWR and get the same thing. Everyone applauded, the answer given was wishi washi. There is more to this. "

 

I got that from the Yahoo board. Since I did not listen to the Q&A of the Sprint presentation I can't say if this accurate, but if so this lady has it right.

 

Cardboard

[bmichaud]

"There was a lady in the audience today during the presentation, why spend $10 billion when you can spend $600 mm with your subsidiary CLWR and get the same thing. Everyone applauded, the answer given was wishi washi. There is more to this. "

 

I got that from the Yahoo board. Since I did not listen to the Q&A of the Sprint presentation I can't say if this accurate, but if so this lady has it right.

 

Cardboard

 

Cardboard - to that exact point, this is what I said earlier today to brker_guy and Valuecarl:

 

"There are absolutely no words to describe Hesse. You're spending $10B to build out your own LTE network when CLWR is $1b away from a 20X20 in all the largest markets? What the eff if is wrong with them? China Mobile is pioneering the LTE advanced technology and is working with CLWR to create an ecosystem for associated devices and they decide to go their own way with a 5x5 network?"

 

[ubuy2wron]

Falcone is an expert in distressed debt he is also fighting for his life if his venture can not get off the ground he will lose his Guccione mansion. I think the idea is to try to put CLWR into bk, the problem their is MCCaw and the other players can always outbid anyone else if there is value in the carcass. Frankly I think they all are doomed at this stage Sprint, CLWR ,and Falcone .

Hess will only lose his job the founders of CLWR have already got pretty much no skin in the game its only Falcone who is fighting for his life. Maybe Carlos can make some dough with this mess he bought a place in New York and seems to want to buy the NY Times.

[brker_guy]

"Falcone is an expert in distressed debt he is also fighting for his life if his venture can not get off the ground he will lose his Guccione mansion. "

 

Falcone might be an expert debt, but he knows NOTHING about wireless communication.  Falcone is a high finance guy that Charlie Munger likes to make fun of.  He wants to be an engineer when he has no idea what jamming means.  For him to go up agains the Department of Defense and the national security of the country is like asking for death.

 

"I think the idea is to try to put CLWR into bk, the problem their is MCCaw and the other players can always outbid anyone else if there is value in the carcass."

 

Uh, I hate to be the bearer of bad news McCaw has been out of CLWR for nearly a year now.

 

"Hess will only lose his job the founders of CLWR have already got pretty much no skin in the game its only Falcone who is fighting for his life."

 

Huh?  CLWR founders have no skin in the game?  Are you sure about that?  You might like to ask the MSOs and Google.  They also hold stakes in CLWR. 

 

As for Falcone fighting for his life, I sure hope Falcone is not stricken with some illness.  If you mean LightSquared fighting for its life, you BETCHA they are fighting for the miserable life!  The Pentagon is coming after LightSquared with guns slinging, and no pun intended for that...

 

http://www.executivegov.com/2011/10/grassley-says-taxpayers-shouldnt-pay-for-lightsquared-retrofit/

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/lightsquared-fcc-face-criticism-from-republican-lawmakers/2011/09/29/gIQAWVxM8K_story.html

 

So, I sure hope LightSquared have Plan B and Plan C lying around somewhere in their back office.

 

Finally, here is the Sprint Strategy Update presentation, minute by minute:

 

http://www.bgr.com/2011/10/07/live-from-sprints-strategy-update-event/

 

[CONeal]

One one of the slides in the presentation. sprint has the ability to cancel the agreement with Lightsquared at the end of the year if they have not been approved by the FCC.

 

Getting approval by eoy is slim to none, basically, everything in today's presentation may turn out to be an exercise in public speaking.

 

 

[ubuy2wron]

Brkr-guy. I believe CLWR was a McCaw start up and I think he did just fine on his investment when the thing went public. If this thing goes BK you have MCCaw and a bunch of other really deep pocketed investors like GOOG  and MCCaw able to pick over the carcass. Light Speed and Falcone are one and the same my opinion of Falcone is pretty much in line with Mungers and Hesse well his ego I think may destroy Sprint. I have said it before I do not think there will be any winners here only losers. It appears to me that Hesse has ticked off Intel ,GooG the McCaws not a group I would like to be mad at me.

[Cardboard]

A guy like David Einhorn can't be too happy tonight with Sprint if he is still an owner. Greenlight owned $301 million worth of Sprint shares as of June 30 out of a managed pool of $4.68 billion or a big 6.4% and their 4th largest holding. The guy has been an activist in some instances. Let's hope that he does something to straight things out.

 

Regarding Stanton, he owns around 4.5 million shares of CLWR. I would agree that it is not much skin in the game considering he is worth around $1 billion. It will be interesting to see what he does here. His reputation as a great wireless developer is at stake here.

 

Cardboard

[bmichaud]

A guy like David Einhorn can't be too happy tonight with Sprint if he is still an owner. Greenlight owned $301 million worth of Sprint shares as of June 30 out of a managed pool of $4.68 billion or a big 6.4% and their 4th largest holding. The guy has been an activist in some instances. Let's hope that he does something to straight things out.

 

Regarding Stanton, he owns around 4.5 million shares of CLWR. I would agree that it is not much skin in the game considering he is worth around $1 billion. It will be interesting to see what he does here. His reputation as a great wireless developer is at stake here.

 

Cardboard

 

You and peter_burke make a good point regarding Stanton's overall net worth. Perhaps he is throwing CLWR shareholders a bone by putting in $5 to $10MM....

[JHelg]

Ho--lee--Crap.

 

I didn't see that coming. I just don't get it. Listening to the conference call, you just get a sense that Sprint is really pissed off at Clearwire and is intent on trying to force bankruptcy IMO.

 

Is there anyway that Clearwire can force Sprint's hand or get rid of Sprint? Can the BOD of Clearwire somehow do something if a majority holder is not acting in the best interest of the company? I'm still pretty new to investing, and I'm just wondering if there is anything that can be done to get rid of Sprint or loosen their power over Clearwire because of their huge stake (I know they don't have a majority voting power, but they still own a good chunk). It doesn't seem like they'll cooperate or help out Clearwire with anything, given the last couple weeks' developments.

 

Is bankruptcy really an option or will Clearwire just dilute and issue more shares?--this seems like a much better option than bankruptcy considering the underlying value of the spectrum.

 

Thoughts?

[bmichaud]

Ho--lee--Crap.

 

I didn't see that coming. I just don't get it. Listening to the conference call, you just get a sense that Sprint is really pissed off at Clearwire and is intent on trying to force bankruptcy IMO.

 

Is there anyway that Clearwire can force Sprint's hand or get rid of Sprint? Can the BOD of Clearwire somehow do something if a majority holder is not acting in the best interest of the company? I'm still pretty new to investing, and I'm just wondering if there is anything that can be done to get rid of Sprint or loosen their power over Clearwire because of their huge stake (I know they don't have a majority voting power, but they still own a good chunk). It doesn't seem like they'll cooperate or help out Clearwire with anything, given the last couple weeks' developments.

 

Is bankruptcy really an option or will Clearwire just dilute and issue more shares?--this seems like a much better option than bankruptcy considering the underlying value of the spectrum.

 

Thoughts?

 

Not when Sprint IS their business.

[JHelg]

Not when Sprint IS their business.

 

Yes, but I'm thinking more like in order to sell to somebody that would appreciate their spectrum (Dish, Cox, Google, China Mobile, etc.--yes, many are long shots). Wouldn't a potential suitor be turned away because Sprint was not willing to play nice?

[Cardboard]

Clearwire at this time is free to do what it needs. Sprint did everything it could to avoid carrying the $4 billion of debt on its balance sheet. So they tried to show less than 50% economic and voting interest in CLWR to go around their debt covenant. The recent discussion from CLWR that they are looking at other companies to do business with is also indicative of that freedom.

 

The other thing that is really stupid from Sprint is that you don't try to kill an investment that you carry at $2.1 billion on your balance sheet (as of June 30). You try to maximize that value internally or via a sale.

 

Regarding a CLWR bankruptcy, at that point Sprint loses all voting interest. It is equity. So it is the debt holders that call the shots and their interest is to get back their principal and any unpaid interest. They won't care about Sprint and Hesse's chicanery. They will try to sell the spectrum and assets to the highest bidder or take a stake in the company if they can see an operating profit post restructuring.

 

One thing that is unclear to me is the "runoff" strategy of Sprint regarding Wimax. They say that they will continue selling Wimax devices until the end of 2012. These devices will still need a tower/architecture to talk to post 2012. So, Clearwire will still need to carry that traffic since I don't believe it will be possible to move that to the Sprint Network Vision 3G/4G LTE CDMA single box. Is that right? 

 

The only reason that I can find explaining Sprint's actions is that they don't want to be alone in the U.S. with TDD-LTE which is Clearwire's path forward. Are they concerned about devices compatibility with TDD vs FDD which is now the standard even if inferior? Is it possible for Clearwire to move its Wimax to FDD-LTE?

 

Cardboard

[txlaw]

So I finally got time to digest what's been going on with S/CLWR.

 

Yesterday's events show exactly why I decided to take a loss on CLWR a month or two ago and revisit after the S presentation.  It does not surprise me that both S and CLWR have collapsed in price.  There are too many questions unanswered.

 

Here's what I think is going on. 

 

Dan Hesse is trying to change the business model of Sprint going forward so that it does not really own (or license) the spectrum -- which is like real estate for wireless communications -- that is necessary for a 4G service.  Instead, S will provide: (1) a revenue-generating "spectrum hosting platform" that can swap out both wireless technologies and spectrum over time; (2) wholesale service for customers like AMZN; and (3) a retail front for 4G (and successor) mobility services.  S really only wants to own the network infrastructure and be the brand that earns a retail profit on providing a nationwide 4G service built on top of the spectrum owned by wholesale providers (though it too is a wholesale provider, it could conceivably decide to spin off or sell and leaseback its spectrum after the transition to 4G).

 

This might explain the rather unfortunate slide in the S presentation quoting WEB -- "I try to buy stock in businesses that are so wonderful that an idiot can run them.  Because sooner or later, one will."  Only it appears that idiots might actually be running the business before it becomes wonderful (if at all).

 

Hesse seems to want CLWR to be in a position to pay S for being hosted on Sprint's network.  The money collected from retail customers for the Sprint branded 4G service will be passed through to CLWR (pro rata based on CLWR spectrum utilized versus other wholesale spectrum) with S collecting a retail profit + hosting fees, and S will take a hosting fee from money collected from CLWR's wholesale customers (which could include the MSOs and even VZ or T-Rex) when spectrum used is hosted on Sprint's network infrastructure. 

 

The problem with this idea is that Sprint's retail brand is worthless over the long run if it does not have the ability to give its retail customers a full 4G experience, and in the long run it cannot do so without being able to utilize CLWR's spectrum.  So S needs CLWR as much as CLWR needs S, unless it can successfully stop the T-Rex/T-Mo merger. 

 

However, according to S, it will not need access to more spectrum until later on.  So S appears to be betting on two potential outcomes. 

 

Outcome 1: CLWR will be forced into BK, debt will be converted to equity at a really attractive prices for debt holders, and then S will partner up with CLWR's post-BK owners after getting rid of existing management and governance structure, with CLWR selling wholesale to S and S getting attractive rates by hosting some of the spectrum.  BK does not mean that CLWR equity holders are screwed, especially those of you who have very low cost bases, but it could mean having to wait a while to realize value.

 

Outcome 2: CLWR is recapitalized out of BK, and the newer investors will essentially go along with Sprint's vision and stop a duplicative network infrastructure build out, agreeing to wholesale the majority of its spectrum assets to Sprint for the 4G service and buy hosting on Sprint's network infrastructure.

 

But what happens if the post-BK or post-recapitalization owners decide to continue to build out the CLWR network and tell S to eff off, providing an alternative 4G network that can be sold through various retail outlets (such as through the MSOs or DISH)?  Or what if CLWR decides to just sell a large chunk of capacity to a VZ, thus raising capital on its own, and uses that money to continue its build out to support an MSO/DISH hybrid 4G network, and then refuses to do business with Sprint, favoring these other retail outlets?  And does it make sense to have a build-out plan like this when it could potentially cost Sprint less to just buy or recapitalize Clearwire in order to provide a full fledged 4G network?

 

Sprint needs to think very hard about what this antagonistic approach to its relationship with CLWR could mean to its future prospects.

 

Something tells me Charlie Ergen has been buying up CLWR debt and may somehow get involved in a New Clearwire situation.

[Cardboard]

I have tried hard understanding Sprint motives too, but I am getting lost.

 

Basically, it would cost $900 million to upgrade current Clearwire coverage to TDD-LTE and support the business. If you are to expand coverage to the full nation, I am not sure what the cost is, but I figure it should be somewhat less than the $5 billion already spent to date.

 

This network would be state of the art 4G, better than anything Verizon or AT&T can offer in terms of speed and it could be on an unlimited data plan due to the large spectrum. Another thing that competition cannot offer.

 

So it is more than the $600 million quoted by the lady at the conference, but still less than the $10 billion that Sprint will have to put up.

 

What Sprint is trying to do IMO is to reduce costs without much regard for the upfront capital investment and long term implications. Free cash flow will look better, but return on capital may suck. I understand that the maintenance costs, training, inventory, energy, space to support one "box" vs 3 currently (IDen, 2G/3G CDMA and Wimax 4G) is more expensive along with paying fees to Clearwire, so I understand their desire. Where the strategy fails IMO is the timing. Their CDMA 4G within that box will be old technology by the time they are done rolling it out. This should have been looked at 2 or 3 years ago. They will also be short spectrum with their unlimited data plan which is probably the only differentiator with their brand. They also seem to ignore that if Clearwire succeeds that they are earning half the profits from it and any business appreciation. I am sure that it is not included in their NPV calculation to justify that investment.

 

TDD-LTE by Clearwire is like 5G vs what they are trying to implement. And they will spend $10 billion instead of say $5 divided by 2 (again they own about half of Clearwire) to obtain temporary cost savings. Forcing IDen on the CDMA 3G platform makes sense if it pays on its own. If not, might as well shut it down if it is not profitable.

 

I think that they have been attracted by the money LightSquared is waiving at them and decided to take the risk. And if it fails, they may turn back to Clearwire in bankruptcy or otherwise. I believe that they are ignoring that Clearwire could takeoff on its own.

 

The good news for Clearwire is that it has been said many times in the conference that CLWR made choices on their own, so now they are kind of paying the price for it. This independance tells me that management and other players are free to do what they want. So I would expect someone with more "vision" than Hesse to show up and to continue building the Clearwire network. At some point, it may even host Verizon and AT&T as they deliver the "new" LTE to their customers.

 

Cardboard

[JHelg]

BK does not mean that CLWR equity holders are screwed, especially those of you who have very low cost bases, but it could mean having to wait a while to realize value.

 

Ok, this is very interesting to me. I am admittedly very new to investing, but have been sucked into it hook, line, and sinker (much thanks to the Board for getting me this far).

 

I spent countless hours looking into Clearwire after reading through this thread, and eventually bought a bunch in the mid- and low twos. I just was not expecting Sprint to behave this way--it defies all logic--and the conference call scared me, because they sound really ticked at Clearwire. I'm now wondering if I cut some of my losses and just sell some to see what happens, because I just don't understand what happens if Clearwire does file bankruptcy. You are saying that a position in Clearwire would not necessarily be lost in bankruptcy? Can you or anybody else elaborate on this?

 

Again, I really appreciate all the great information you all provide. I try to contribute when I can but I'm still learning. I just finished "Buffett: The Making of an American Capitalist," and I'm in the middle of "The Intelligent Investor." I find this board to be the most informative--I just wish I could contribute more substance than I currently am able.

 

Thanks!

[txlaw]

But can it really be the L-Squared money that has caused them to act this way?  Sprint knows that that money will dry up if the GPS issue blows up in Falcone's face.

 

They're definitely taking the risk that CLWR goes it alone with non-Sprint partners.  Look, Charlie Ergen owns quite a bit of satellite spectrum that can be used to build out an MSS/ATC network in conjunction with CLWR.  The MSOs are starting to offer citywide broadband service and are, IMO, preparing to offer broadband everywhere by filling in the gaps in their network by buying wholesale 4G.  The CLWR CEO has essentially said that CLWR wants to be the Switzerland of 4G and that they are talking to T-Rex and VZ to provide them additional capacity.  If S is not factoring in that CMCSK, DISH, or T-Rex/VZ could potentially pull the rug out from under them by getting very close to CLWR, then S management are idiots and they should sue Goldman for giving them poor strategic advice. 

 

More likely, CLWR has told S that they will not be a primary wholesale partner for Sprint's 4G service and will not use S as a spectrum hosting platform unless Sprint commits to providing more capital to CLWR than it already has and commits to using CLWR as its primary partner for the 4G service for the long run.  Sprint, I believe, has gambled that the capital markets will assess the situation after their presentation such that Sprint's cost of capital goes down while CLWR's cost of capital goes up, allowing Sprint to raise money and deploy into its CLWR subsidiary such that the dilution is offset by their extracting economics from the CLWR minority investors.  But the market appears to understand that this bluff is stupid because the cost of building out their own network infrastructure alone exceeds the cost of helping CLWR expand its network.

 

Sprint's decision to delay raising capital and make a decision on its long term 4G strategy by partnering with CLWR has cost it dearly because now the capital markets will demand far more from S equity investors.

[txlaw]

BK does not mean that CLWR equity holders are screwed, especially those of you who have very low cost bases, but it could mean having to wait a while to realize value.

 

Ok, this is very interesting to me. I am admittedly very new to investing, but have been sucked into it hook, line, and sinker (much thanks to the Board for getting me this far).

 

I spent countless hours looking into Clearwire after reading through this thread, and eventually bought a bunch in the mid- and low twos. I just was not expecting Sprint to behave this way--it defies all logic--and the conference call scared me, because they sound really ticked at Clearwire. I'm now wondering if I cut some of my losses and just sell some to see what happens, because I just don't understand what happens if Clearwire does file bankruptcy. You are saying that a position in Clearwire would not necessarily be lost in bankruptcy? Can you or anybody else elaborate on this?

 

Again, I really appreciate all the great information you all provide. I try to contribute when I can but I'm still learning. I just finished "Buffett: The Making of an American Capitalist," and I'm in the middle of "The Intelligent Investor." I find this board to be the most informative--I just wish I could contribute more substance than I currently am able.

 

Thanks!

 

Well, just because a company files for BK does not mean that equity holders are necessarily wiped out.  It's just that in most cases, that happens.

 

Ultimately, it depends on how the BK process works out.  Creditor's committees and all that jazz.  I'm not a BK guy, but I know enough about reorgs that you can be in a good position afterwards depending on the value of the assets, where you are in the capital structure, and the price you pay for your investment.  But you're going to have to come to a conclusion on what will happen and how much the equity is worth if it's worth anything at all.

 

Not to be a jerk about this, but if you're just starting out, there are easier investments out there than S/CLWR, especially if you are a novice to telecom/technology (not that you are).

[txlaw]

i see a trade developing in clwr. tell me if I'm wrong. Sprint is saying LS is their number 2 choice for 4g. But S has an out if LS can't get regulatory approval by end of year. nothing happens in in DC in November and December and LS is under intense scrutiny right now. it would be a miracle for them to get the approval. this would give S an Out and make CLWR much more valuable as a source for 4g network infrastructure. I see CLWR going up in the news that S gets out of the LS relationship.

 

Yeah, could be a good trade.