BH - Biglari Holdings

[giofranchi]

Selling at any price is not. There is a inherent value to any business and selling with for example 99% discount to that is irrational (except if you know of an investment with an even larger discount).

 

Ok, let’s put it this way: do you believe in staying inside your circle of competence? What’s the price you are willing to pay for something outside your circle of competence? Difficult to say, right? And what if I say that an insurer which achieves CRs around 70%, once left by the “Master” who has achieved such unbelievably low CRs for almost 20 years, suddenly falls outside my circle of competence?

 

Gio

 

[tombgrt]

Selling at any price is not. There is a inherent value to any business and selling with for example 99% discount to that is irrational (except if you know of an investment with an even larger discount).

 

Ok, let’s put it this way: do you believe in staying inside your circle of competence? What’s the price you are willing to pay for something outside your circle of competence? Difficult to say, right? And what if I say that an insurer which achieves CRs around 70%, once left by the “Master” who has achieved such unbelievably low CRs for almost 20 years, suddenly falls outside my circle of competence?

 

Gio

 

 

If your circle of competence is dependent on the manager running the company, you don't have a circle of competence in the first place. Don't kid yourself.

For all I care it's ok not to have a circle of competence, just don't tell yourself you have it solely because you rely on the track record of a CEO and his kind letters to shareholders, that just doesn't cut it.

 

I do appreciate your endless optimism! (no sarcasm here) I don't think there are a lot of millionaires here who even dare to think of achieving a $1billion net worth (assuming $2million equity in your company that is 100% personally owned compounded at 15% for 45 years). Good luck, you'll need it IMO as it will not be an easy feat.

 

 

All may be true, but I have so rarely seen someone so passionate in the defense of a CEO.

Just trying to figure out why. Ultimately this will all sort itself out via SEC fillings and BH events.

 

This is fast becoming about as useful a thread as the one on Sears or the one on LVLT.

 

Well, Ragu has definitely put his money where his mouth is (I believe >50% of his portfolio is in BH) and he is in it for the long haul.

 

My last word on this thread (and not directed at you Myth):

 

what I find disconcerting is that there are folks on this thread who believed Chad Wasilenkoff was the second coming of Buffett just a year earlier ignoring the excessive compensation, share price destruction yada yada yada. Yet they are out here on this thread pontificating on Sardar/BH with no position in the stock. Why not throw water on your burning house before you help your neighbor?

 

Besides, BH has fared much much better than FTP. We will just have to wait and see how well he does.

 

PS: No position in BH and I have mixed feelings about Sardar

 

If you are talking about me among others, I sold the stock during 2013 at prices multiples of what it is now. It was a huge mistake and lesson ... and ... exactly why I try to warn Gio of the dangers of focussing on management too much. Sooner or later he will get burned if he believes his circle of competence solely comes from believing in management.

 

I wish there was a very vocal "pretentious asshole" (as some might think of me that way now!  ;)) back then in the FTP thread who called me a fool, maybe I would have realized my mistake sooner. Maybe there was one (some definitely said something) and maybe I was lost anyway, I don't know. I think being an "ass" about things on this forum can have it's advantages. Let me know if you disagree Gio! ;)

[txitxo]

  Come on, guys, lay off Gio. I think that the strategy he is following is quite rational.

 

 

So no one is picking on Gio...they just don't like what he is feeding us!  Cheers! 

 

I agree with the critics of Biglari, as I said in my posting:

 

  Regarding BH, yes, Biglari is likely to keep generating significant alpha in the future. But his long term track record indicates that most of that overperformance will go to his pocket, and not the shareholders'...

 

But in this thread I was reading about platitudes, Berlusconi, LRE, etc. I don't think that has anything to do with Biglari.... :)

[giofranchi]

If your circle of competence is dependent on the manager running the company, you don't have a circle of competence in the first place. Don't kid yourself.

For all I care it's ok not to have a circle of competence, just don't tell yourself you have it solely because you rely on the track record of a CEO and his kind letters to shareholders, that just doesn't cut it.

 

Ok, if you don’t want to talk about “circle of competence”, I will call it "whatever gives me great conviction in a business future prospects". When we are talking about insurance, management is very important imo. Management is very important in a lot of other businesses as well… (Just out of curiosity, Tom, have you ever tried to run a business yourself? When you say management is not important, is it because you have read that somewhere, or because you are running a business that goes on autopilot, without the need of any strategic decision by you?)... But insurance results in particular are very subject to management’s behavior and discipline. 70% CRs are like 20% annual returns in investing: would you invest in The Baupost Group, if Mr. Klarman were to leave it?

 

The fact I require a great manager (to have great conviction in a business future prospects) doesn’t mean I rely solely on a great manager. I have said many times what I look for, besides a great manager! Otherwise, I would have invested in DELL, in SHLD, and probably in FTP. But I did not. ;)

 

Gio

 

[giofranchi]

I do appreciate your endless optimism! (no sarcasm here) I don't think there are a lot of millionaires here who even dare to think of achieving a $1billion net worth (assuming $2million equity in your company that is 100% personally owned compounded at 15% for 45 years). Good luck, you'll need it IMO as it will not be an easy feat.

 

Ahahahahah!!!! You know how the saying goes: you might have a goal, but what’s truly important is that you should enjoy the travel!

 

Ops… guess this is just another platitude of mine! ;D ;D

 

Gio

 

[tombgrt]

I know that you look at other things as well Gio, my point is that you can't partly disregard other aspects because management is good. You will now tell me that you don't and that management is simply a requirement but from what I have read I simply do think that you give way too much weight to management and what they say and do. I've learned the hard way that it's the numbers that speak the loudest and help to stay objective and give an objective view (unless there is fraud involved of course! ;)). LRE will be a great case in that regard: Will it slip into mediocrity quickly or will Brindle's talent leave a lasting effect for the foreseeable future?

 

Also, I have never said management is not important. It is one of many important factors. I do however believe that management is more than it's CEO and that there are things like culture that are equally, if not more, important for the lasting success of a business. We just seem to differ too much in opinion on this subject.

[giofranchi]

Listen, Tom… I really don’t want to sound polemic here… I know you are very young and very smart… Period.

 

In my first 10 years as a business owner and manager I think I have added much to the overall well-being of my companies… but I have made lots of mistakes too! And ready cash at hand is what has always saved me, when I happened to make a poor choice. Because it has always given me staying power and a chance to do something new. Ready cash at hand has always been possible because both businesses of mine operate in industries not much subject to change, and because their operations require relatively little capital to be maintained. We don’t enjoy great competitive advantages, therefore margins are low, but what little earnings we have are safe, predictable, and can be invested elsewhere in almost their entirety. And that’s what I mean when I say “steady and safe free cash flow”.

 

Therefore, my experience is simply this: a very good owner/manager can surely make a difference, but even him/her needs a machine that keeps giving him/her new cash. And that machine should function as safely and predictably as possible.

 

I look at the stock market because I know my own businesses will never enjoy scale. Already, if I didn’t invest in the stock market, I wouldn’t be able to use all the capital at my disposal: my businesses simply don’t need it. I look at the stock market to get the scale my businesses will always lack… But, do you find so perplexing that I search in the stock market for those same characteristics that have served me very well until now in my experience as a business owner/manager?

 

Of course you might disagree, but I would call this "circle of competence". ;)

 

Gio

 

[premfan]

Hello Gio,

 

You seem like a great businessman and a rational investor.  Hence I don't see why you seek approval and validation in your approach. Continue compounding and living the dream. Forcing people to see the world in your view is a recipe for argument and useless semantics.  If your desire is to be a teacher or future investment guru then results speak louder than words. I would encourage you to build a public track record. This would satisfy your urge to preach your thoughts ( via shareholder letters).

 

It seems to me the context of the majority of your posts is teaching. You enjoy explaining your investment process. I bet you would write brilliant shareholder letters. Maybe investigate how to get in the public domain. This would build you credibility and a platform to teach to your followers.

 

premfan

no doubt that whenever gio gets actively involved in a thread it elicits a lot of interest! that's especially true when its a stock he has a position in & conviction in (actually, does gio ever have a stock position he doesn't also have conviction in?). his passion, generosity, & unfailing gentlemanly conduct is contagious. look at how the lre thread has all but dried up & withered since he sold & lost interest, despite the oft brilliant commentary from twa.

 

I don't get the same impression at all that gio seeks approval or validation or is interested in forcing people to share his world view. I think he just genuinely enjoys & seeks to learn from the debate between different & often diametrically opposed viewpoints.

 

Reading makes a full Man, Meditation a profound Man, discourse a clear Man

--Ben Franklin

 

This is the only reason why I like contributing to the board so much: because I have found out that the process of a) writing about an investment thesis of mine, b) receiving feedbacks from many people around the world, with different cultural and working backgrounds, and c) reasoning about their responses and answering back, is a great way to get “clearness” of mind, and therefore conviction about an investment opportunity.

 

Besides this, I really don’t care about approval and validation, I don’t care about public fame or a public track-record, I certainly don’t care about forcing the way I see the world on anyone (I even doubt there is a “way” I look at the world…), and of course I couldn’t care less about teaching platitudes to anyone!! ;)

 

All I care for:

1) To live many joyful moments with the people I love

2) To compound my capital at 15% annual for the next 45 years

 

PS

I must admit I also find arguing with people who disagree with me… until they finally agree with me… to be much fun!! ;D ;D ;D

 

Gio

 

Hello Gio,

 

My post was just a suggestion for you to leverage your passion for teaching and preaching your investment philosophy. If you do have the returns you state and your business has stable cash flow you already have the platform to go public. This would build you credibility and give you followers to achieve 15 % annual for 45 years. 

 

There is a hint of superiority in your some of posts when you state you manage business's. Your assumption is that people that dont agree with your positionality must not be business owners. I manage 3 business's.  Two for my family holding company and one i started 3 years.  Many board members i would bet manage business's.  Yet we dont state this constantly to create polarization. Gio, you are not the only person using the "blueprint". 

 

There is a huge market developing in  "finding the next buffett". I think anyone with a passion for teaching value investing and has a cash machine would be wise to list.  In the end everything reveals itself automatically.  Until then i cant take you seriously. You are just some random guy thats creating polarization by trying to force people to  agree with your positionalities.  And yes Gio you are using force. Anything that creates counter force used force.

 

[giofranchi]

Hello Gio,

 

My post was just a suggestion for you to leverage your passion for teaching and preaching your investment philosophy. If you do have the returns you state and your business has stable cash flow you already have the platform to go public. This would build you credibility and give you followers to achieve 15 % annual for 45 years. 

 

There is a hint of superiority in your some of posts when you state you manage business's. Your assumption is that people that dont agree with your positionality must not be business owners. I manage 3 business's.  Two for my family holding company and one i started 3 years.  Many board members i would bet manage business's.  Yet we dont state this constantly to create polarization. Gio, you are not the only person using the "blueprint". 

 

There is a huge market developing in  "finding the next buffett". I think anyone with a passion for teaching value investing and has a cash machine would be wise to list.  In the end everything reveals itself automatically.  Until then i cant take you seriously. You are just some random guy thats creating polarization by trying to force people to  agree with your positionalities.  And yes Gio you are using force. Anything that creates counter force used force.

 

Hi premfan,

 

Why would I tell you I don’t mind teaching, if it weren’t the truth?

 

Why would I tell you that my businesses don’t require capital, and therefore there is no reason to take them public, if it weren’t the truth?

 

If I ask people’s background, whether they are business owners or traders or something else, it is because I want to understand their point of view. And I think points of view are greatly affected by people’s experience. Do you think they are not?

 

I don’t understand what you mean by “using force”… I thought I was forced into explaining what writser called my “thought process”… I thought I was called the master of platitudes… In other words, I thought mine was just “self-defense”!! ;D ;D ;D

 

No, seriously, if I have sounded arrogant and forceful, I apologize.

 

Cheers,

 

Gio

 

[premfan]

Hello Gio,

 

My post was just a suggestion for you to leverage your passion for teaching and preaching your investment philosophy. If you do have the returns you state and your business has stable cash flow you already have the platform to go public. This would build you credibility and give you followers to achieve 15 % annual for 45 years. 

 

There is a hint of superiority in your some of posts when you state you manage business's. Your assumption is that people that dont agree with your positionality must not be business owners. I manage 3 business's.  Two for my family holding company and one i started 3 years.  Many board members i would bet manage business's.  Yet we dont state this constantly to create polarization. Gio, you are not the only person using the "blueprint". 

 

There is a huge market developing in  "finding the next buffett". I think anyone with a passion for teaching value investing and has a cash machine would be wise to list.  In the end everything reveals itself automatically.  Until then i cant take you seriously. You are just some random guy thats creating polarization by trying to force people to  agree with your positionalities.  And yes Gio you are using force. Anything that creates counter force used force.

 

Hi premfan,

 

Why would I tell you I don’t mind teaching, if it weren’t the truth?

 

Why would I tell you that my businesses don’t require capital, and therefore there is no reason to take them public, if it weren’t the truth?

 

If I ask people’s background, whether they are business owners or traders or something else, it is because I want to understand their point of view. And I think points of view are greatly affected by one’s experience. Do you think they are not?

 

I don’t understand what you mean by “using force”… I thought I was forced into explaining what writser called my “thought process”… I thought I was called the master of platitudes… In other words, I thought mine was just “self-defense”!! ;D ;D ;D

No, seriously, if I have sounded arrogant and forceful, I apologize.

 

Cheers,

 

Gio

 

Hello Gio,

 

This is my last post on this ( i feel like michael corleone in the godfather movie "just when i thought i was out, they pull me back in").  Ultimately,  the beauty of buffett is the blueprint he has left for us.  We all have the ability to be mini buffetts.  Its going from the "knowing" to the "becoming" paradigm shift.

 

There comes a point when we all want to "become" instead of "know".  Be willing to experience instead of reading a book and feeling like we "know" about the subject.  What i'm getting at is you seem passionate and most importantly able to invest ( from what you say).  I'm a below average- average investor. I love managing more than investing.  I couldnt market myself as the next brk.  Because my track record is not good enough

 

Passionate teachers/preachers with a good-great track record have a huge market opportunity to fill a market niche.  Thats why i encourage you to "become" instead of "knowing". Instead of looking for owner/operators become one yourself in the public.  This is my intention only  Gio.  There is a huge untapped niche market out there.

[rayfinkle]

On the management / culture point: I've worked with many CEO's (as an investor and later as an operator). I'm 100% confident that good CEO's drive "good" culture--this isn't something that I can prove, but more than most things in business I'm certain of it. It's entirely possible to have a good operator as a CEO--one that is technically competent, can make deals & manage shareholders, etc.--but is nonetheless not a cultural leader. In my experience these CEO's create more fragile organizations.

 

My two cents is that having a great CEO who is also a cultural leader (many founder/entrepreneur CEOs are), when combined with other necessary investment characteristics, can supercharge a company (and potentially an investment). Having said this, consistently getting the assessment of a leadership team/CEO right is not something I know how to do...

 

Finally--to add another dimension--I've known CEOs that are technically great (know in an academic sense how to grow intrinsic value, and are good at executing this), drive "healthy" organizational behavior (that presumably flows [indirectly] to the bottom line), and are still greedy, selfish, overpaid, sharkish, comfortable "stretching the truth," and generally unpleasant to be around. Buffett seems to have a gift for discerning what matters vs. what doesn't here--but he still doesn't always get it right (Sokol). Anywho...

[rayfinkle]

Also, can someone explain valuetrap's statement that during rights offerings for Liberty/TCI malone's shareholders had a choice, but BH's don't?

[Myth465]

Gio I think people think you care what others think because when you get involved in a thread the discuss quickly moves away from the merits of the investment and into a decision about what you require as an investor.

 

You see all things through that framework and counter any point with your "philosophy". It becomes a platitude, but its the answer to just about every question about an Owner Manager company you hold. I can probably type it out word for word and post it in the ALS, Third Point, FFH, threads as a reply to a question.

 

Perhaps it works for you, but it really sidelines the discussions relating to the metrics of the individual idea, and inmo defeats the point of these boards.

 

With Lanesbourgh - I wanted to know what I was missing on an idea I have held for a few months. In the process I was challenged and forced to dig deeply to answer those questions. I may have convinced someone to buy along the way. Either way we both learned more about the idea and now I know what Mr. Market is thinking. I can now review the investment in a better light. Now we may both lose money with me taking him down with a bad idea, or we may both make money, but ultimately we both understanding the holding more. I have no idea if he owns $10k or $100k, but his questions forced me to think more about the idea. The discussion was about the idea and not his requirements being explained 20 times.

 

http://www.cornerofberkshireandfairfax.ca/forum/investment-ideas/lrt-to-lanesborough-reit/

 

Similar with Life Time Fitness. Yada and I shared our thoughts about why we didnt like the idea. The original poster may invest, and we will likely move on to other things. We think its fairly valued. He may have learned something or not. We have made our points and will move on. We think its fairly valued, we require more. He may not, but points have been made.

 

---

 

When you get involved in an idea it turns into a discussion about you running your own business, compounding wealth for 20 years at 15%, your love of owner managers, ect. For example look at the Clarke thread, you basically almost turned a productive thread where anyone who invested made 30% - 50% into that whole spill about your "philosophy" which went on for a few pages.

 

Ragu has made his point, and moved on. He will likely continue to comment as new things on BH are released and will analysis the business as a business. I can respect that even though we clearly dont agree. His point is to learn about an idea in which he has a substantial portion of his wealth behind. Similar to me with Clarke which was a 35% holding at one point. I think we will all learn from these posts, and hopefully he makes money.

 

You will likely continue to repost the same info about being an owner manager to any reply to this thread.  I dont really see the point, but thats just me.

We know more about your goals, and what you require from an idea, then perhaps any other poster on this board....  I would also say I know less about what you think about the merits of any of the ideas you post on than any of the other people posting in those investment options.

 

Just my overvalued 2 cents.....

[Liberty]

Maybe Gio wouldn't have to spend quite so much time defending his approach if people accepted that it works for him and stopped constantly challenging him. Just saying.

 

I think it's great that he's transparent about his process and framework, and I wish more successful investors did the same so we could all learn what works for different folks and maybe incorporate some aspects into our own approach.

[Myth465]

Maybe Gio wouldn't have to spend quite so much time defending his approach if people accepted that it works for him and stopped constantly challenging him. Just saying.

 

I think it's great that he's transparent about his process and framework, and I wish more successful investors did the same so we could all learn what works for different folks and maybe incorporate some aspects into our own approach.

 

You could be right.

I am not sure if the conversation continues due to him pushing his point, or others constantly challenging.

I just notice the reoccurring conversation, and not the catalyst.

 

That is a good point, and something I hadnt considered.

I accept it, believe its valid, and believe it could work well especially for someone without the time to review hundreds of ideas.

I even stated so earlier in the thread, where Gio thought I was perhaps making fun of him.

 

People have been trying to push him towards deep value, and I have noticed those back and forths. Perhaps you may be on to something.

Agreeing to disagree has its merits. I have a troll streak, and had to learn along time ago, that sometimes you have to agree to disagree. 

[giofranchi]

I agree with the critics of Biglari, as I said in my posting:

 

  Regarding BH, yes, Biglari is likely to keep generating significant alpha in the future. But his long term track record indicates that most of that overperformance will go to his pocket, and not the shareholders'...

 

I really think you are undervaluing Biglari. Tell me of a single person who has become and stayed extremely rich robbing his/her shareholders… To rob your own shareholders simply is not good business… Therefore, you are undervaluing Biglari. Instead, I think:

1) He will become and stay extremely rich,

2) He knows what’s good business, and what’s not,

3) He will become and stay extremely rich, because he knows what’s good business, and will act accordingly.

 

On the other hand, I also think the fact you don’t like his character and behavior is not a predictive attribute:

Someone brought him up, therefore let’s talk a bit about Berlusconi! Could you imagine a bigger assh… than Berlusconi?! He is circa 80 and was accused of having had sex with a girl not yet 18 years old…! No, even Biglari cannot hold a candle to Berlusconi, when it comes to building for oneself an ill reputation and a bad public image! And don’t even think of comparing Berlusconi’s bloated ego to Biglari’s… Biglari might think he is the king of BH… Berlusconi thought he was the new king of Italy! Talk about orders of magnitude!

Yet, Berlusconi has become and stayed extremely rich… because he knows what’s good business, and has acted accordingly. Needless to say the share prices of his companies have done very well through the years! ;)

 

Finally, also my own experience in business makes me somehow disbelieve your conclusion about Biglari: I have already had many business partners, some were friendly and kind, others were aggressive and arrogant. Everyone of them, with no exception at all, has proven to be reliable, when things were good and easy, instead has proven to be much less reliable, when things went south. That’s why I put much more weight on the owner/manager’s abilities to stir the boat away from any possible danger and towards any opportunity for profitable growth, than on his/her peculiarities of character.

 

Gio

 

[giofranchi]

Gio I think people think you care what others think because when you get involved in a thread the discuss quickly moves away from the merits of the investment and into a decision about what you require as an investor.

 

Myth,

 

I apologize if this might sound egotistical… but I don’t write for you or for anyone else… I write for myself alone.

 

And to know if I want to hold a business for the very long term, I need to make clear very few things… and to continually put those things to the test… to think about them over and over again… to always keep them under check, and to realize if something has changed as soon as possible… I also like other people to challenge my conviction about those few very important things… and to see if, notwithstanding such a challenge, my conviction is still whole or has cracked…

 

Because this is what’s important to me.

 

Of course, one thing is to think and act for personal interest, a completely different thing is to bother other people. Though I don’t take pride in acting solely for my own personal interest, I can at least accept it, until such a behavior begins to harm other people.

My thought is this: well, those who are not interested in what I say… will simply skip all my posts!!

Am I making it too easy? Am I instead really annoying you, tombgrt, writser, premfan, etc.?

 

If so, like I have already said, I apologize. And in the future I will post with much less frequency… only when I am sure I am not repeating myself! ;)

 

Gio

 

[Myth465]

Gio I am just one person here, so I wouldnt recommend changing anything at all.

Also quite a few people seem to get a kick out of your posts.

 

It sounds like we basically do the same thing, except I typically want people to critique the idea I am investing in or posting about, and you want them to challenge the idea in context to your philosophy. At the end of the day the whole point is to leave the table with more chips then your sat down with, hopefully we can all accomplish that goal.

 

 

[wachtwoord]

I agree with the critics of Biglari, as I said in my posting:

 

  Regarding BH, yes, Biglari is likely to keep generating significant alpha in the future. But his long term track record indicates that most of that overperformance will go to his pocket, and not the shareholders'...

 

I really think you are undervaluing Biglari. Tell me of a single person who has become and stayed extremely rich robbing his/her shareholders… To rob your own shareholders simply is not good

 

Michael Dell with his forced buy back miles below fair value.

[giofranchi]

Michael Dell with his forced buy back miles below fair value.

 

Imo Michael Dell is trying desperately to salvage his company... and it doesn't sound like good business to me... ;)

 

I mean, when you are in dire straits… all bets are off… not because Mr. Dell is a rogue… Not at all! I am sure he is a great guy… It is just because business is that way: once you have put yourself in a corner, it is already too late… and men’s behavior becomes as unpredictable as that of a wounded animal… more or less! ;D

 

Anyway, Mr. Dell is still very rich thanks to a large portfolio of investments that have nothing to do with Dell Inc. … Instead, how Dell Inc. will perform in the future is yet to be seen!

 

Gio

[writser]

Gio I think people think you care what others think because when you get involved in a thread the discuss quickly moves away from the merits of the investment and into a decision about what you require as an investor.

 

You see all things through that framework and counter any point with your "philosophy". It becomes a platitude, but its the answer to just about every question about an Owner Manager company you hold. I can probably type it out word for word and post it in the ALS, Third Point, FFH, threads as a reply to a question.

 

[..]

 

Perhaps it works for you, but it really sidelines the discussions relating to the metrics of the individual idea, and inmo defeats the point of these boards.

 

When you get involved in an idea it turns into a discussion about you running your own business, compounding wealth for 20 years at 15%, your love of owner managers, ect. For example look at the Clarke thread, you basically almost turned a productive thread where anyone who invested made 30% - 50% into that whole spill about your "philosophy" which went on for a few pages.

 

[..]

 

You will likely continue to repost the same info about being an owner manager to any reply to this thread.  I dont really see the point, but thats just me.

We know more about your goals, and what you require from an idea, then perhaps any other poster on this board....  I would also say I know less about what you think about the merits of any of the ideas you post on than any of the other people posting in those investment options.

 

Just my overvalued 2 cents.....

 

I agree completely. I find it very hard to do any quantitative, rational analysis when somebody pops in and counters any question, any doubt and any statement with multiple long posts praising great owner-operators, quoting Benjamin Franklin and constantly reminding us he is a manager himself. I think that behaviour kills productive discussions - the ones Ben Graham would like to have. Also, threads like this one suck away attention from the actually interesting threads (for example all the Japan ideas that west has been posting). This is all just my opinion.

 

I try to ignore the noise but occasionally I can't help myself and I feel compelled to point out some (what I think are) glaring inconsistencies. Deep down somewhere I already know that the discussion will be endless, will annoy me at some point and that I should just stay away from it. But at that point I get sucked into it and start doing the very thing I hate to see on this forum: discussing bullshit instead of analysing companies. Gio, you attract this behaviour - I'm not saying it is your fault though :) . Sometimes I feel like the guy in the XKCD cartoon thinking: "there is something WRONG on the internet". I'm sorry. Will try to leave this thread alone for a while.

[Liberty]

I really think you are undervaluing Biglari. Tell me of a single person who has become and stayed extremely rich robbing his/her shareholders… To rob your own shareholders simply is not good business…

 

 

A Former Enron Chairman Is Selling His Texas Mansion For $14 Million

 

http://static1.businessinsider.com/image/53d664b56bb3f76d3b523a5c-921-690/john-wing-enron-house-20-2.jpg

 

;)

 

http://www.businessinsider.com/enron-chairman-selling-mansion-for-14m-2014-7

 

[wachtwoord]

Michael Dell with his forced buy back miles below fair value.

 

Imo Michael Dell is trying desperately to salvage his company... and it doesn't sound like good business to me... ;)

 

I mean, when you are in dire straits… all bets are off… not because Mr. Dell is a rogue… Not at all! I am sure he is a great guy… It is just because business is that way: once you have put yourself in a corner, it is already too late… and men’s behavior becomes as unpredictable as that of a wounded animal… more or less! ;D

 

Anyway, Mr. Dell is still very rich thanks to a large portfolio of investments that have nothing to do with Dell Inc. … Instead, how Dell Inc. will perform in the future is yet to be seen!

 

Gio

 

Mr Dell forcefully took my shares for a price I was not comfortable in selling at (and many shareholders with me). I consider the man a crook and the thief and I would never invest in anything the criminal has anything to do with or even shake his hand hand for that matter.

[giofranchi]

Also, threads like this one suck away attention from the actually interesting threads (for example all the Japan ideas that west has been posting).

 

writser,

the easiest solution is that you stop reading what I post… isn’t it? If it bothers you so much, why questioning my “thought process” and saying it is “flawed”…?! I really don’t understand! It is you who started talking about this… not me!

 

If I had said I find absurd the thought of believing we could know more than other people about some Japanese companies we haven't even heard the names of until some days ago, just because we have performed some “analysis a la Ben Graham”… then I would agree with you: I might have kindled resentment and caused a futile discussion…

 

But it was not me who attacked your thought process… it was the other way around!

 

The same goes for this whole thread: bears are the great majority of posters. Yet, this is the only critique they are able to find: Biglari is a liar and a thief. If that is the only weak spot bears find, in what otherwise I think is a great investment, what do you expect investors in BH to do, except trying to understand if Biglari truly is a liar and a thief?! Not only… It is not enough for the bears to have accused Biglari of being a liar and a thief once… Somehow, and this is another thing I don’t understand…, those very same bears feel compelled to communicate how much Biglari is a liar and a thief again… and after some weeks once again… and so on and on… It really is puzzling!

 

If you are not interested in BH, just leave this thread alone.

 

Gio

 

[giofranchi]

A Former Enron Chairman Is Selling His Texas Mansion For $14 Million

 

Ok, then it is rational to think Biglari would choose to end up like the ex chairman of Enron… worth some millions, when instead he could be worth hundreds of millions; permanently cut off from business, when instead he could be leading a thriving and successful enterprise…  ::)

 

As I have said: bad business.

 

Gio