China to install more than 2,000 gold ATMs

[rmitz]

Your comments here are denigrating the person you are replying to.  Please consider your tone and approach in your responses.

 

It's totally pie in the sky and your whole post is a wasted effort at refuting the chief benefit of a standard that has been the engine of capitalism for 5,000 years. Keep trusting a system that has clearly not worked for anyone but the top 1%, who have toll roads or have stayed ahead of the erosion of their hard earned money by efficiently deploying and redeploying their capital (the extreme minority).

 

Read the Wealth of Nations, Read a World in Debt, read anything pre 1971 and you will see the common denominator was an economy built on trust which was ultimately backed by a sound currency reserved with gold.

 

Its pathetic to even attempt the exercise you are attempting, Do you really think after 5,000 years you are going to sit here and come up with some revelation on an internet message board? You can say you just don't get it or don't agree with it, but to try and refute a gold standard as some type of untrustworthy monetary system is ludicrous. It reminds me of the scene in Social network when the lawyer calculates it cost one of the partners a total of $19K to which Zuckerberg takes a second to check her math. That is what you are doing here. an exercise of futility in an effort to try and protect your argument.

 

For 5,000 years it worked, your beloved fiat system is an experiment that has been in existence on a truly global scale for only 40 years, of which the first 10 during an environment with positive real rates (Volcker era), Oh yeah read about real interest rates as well.

 

Unfortunately you have proven your ignorance.

 

And your employment example is so damn naive, There are nearly 500 million unemployed human beings on planet earth, out of 7 billion not 10 people building a house. Gold mines get developed in places as far off as Siberia the yukon to the Phillipnes, in the US every single town west of the Mississippi was born out of some aspiration for gold. You act as though society is always maintaining maximum employment to a point where resources allocated to gold mining would in turn prevent resources being allocated towards more "productive" areas of the economy. 100% Naive. The multiplier effect of gold mining or any hard rock mining is about 10 or 20 times that of Wall Street gambling, and even 10 or 20 times that of any startup in Silicon Valley. Real Jobs, real wealth creation. Its like manufacturing on crack - mining.

 

Read your history............

 

The world as you know it as you appreciate it has it's roots in a gold backed currency. Not sure what vintage you are but talk to your family members, especially if they lived in North America. Buffett likes to say how standards of living have improved because everyone now has air conditioning and plasma tv's. This is inaccurate, the last 30-40 years have seen people more than ever competing in an ever growing rat race, working far harder for a lot less wealth. This is entirely due to the underlying currency which does not retain its value for longer than 20 years. Thats right, a dollar bill has a lifetime of 20 years, in 20 years its worthless, you need 2 to equal one old dollar.

[moore_capital54]

Your comments here are denigrating the person you are replying to.  Please consider your tone and approach in your responses.

 

It's totally pie in the sky and your whole post is a wasted effort at refuting the chief benefit of a standard that has been the engine of capitalism for 5,000 years. Keep trusting a system that has clearly not worked for anyone but the top 1%, who have toll roads or have stayed ahead of the erosion of their hard earned money by efficiently deploying and redeploying their capital (the extreme minority).

 

Read the Wealth of Nations, Read a World in Debt, read anything pre 1971 and you will see the common denominator was an economy built on trust which was ultimately backed by a sound currency reserved with gold.

 

Its pathetic to even attempt the exercise you are attempting, Do you really think after 5,000 years you are going to sit here and come up with some revelation on an internet message board? You can say you just don't get it or don't agree with it, but to try and refute a gold standard as some type of untrustworthy monetary system is ludicrous. It reminds me of the scene in Social network when the lawyer calculates it cost one of the partners a total of $19K to which Zuckerberg takes a second to check her math. That is what you are doing here. an exercise of futility in an effort to try and protect your argument.

 

For 5,000 years it worked, your beloved fiat system is an experiment that has been in existence on a truly global scale for only 40 years, of which the first 10 during an environment with positive real rates (Volcker era), Oh yeah read about real interest rates as well.

 

Unfortunately you have proven your ignorance.

 

And your employment example is so damn naive, There are nearly 500 million unemployed human beings on planet earth, out of 7 billion not 10 people building a house. Gold mines get developed in places as far off as Siberia the yukon to the Phillipnes, in the US every single town west of the Mississippi was born out of some aspiration for gold. You act as though society is always maintaining maximum employment to a point where resources allocated to gold mining would in turn prevent resources being allocated towards more "productive" areas of the economy. 100% Naive. The multiplier effect of gold mining or any hard rock mining is about 10 or 20 times that of Wall Street gambling, and even 10 or 20 times that of any startup in Silicon Valley. Real Jobs, real wealth creation. Its like manufacturing on crack - mining.

 

Read your history............

 

The world as you know it as you appreciate it has it's roots in a gold backed currency. Not sure what vintage you are but talk to your family members, especially if they lived in North America. Buffett likes to say how standards of living have improved because everyone now has air conditioning and plasma tv's. This is inaccurate, the last 30-40 years have seen people more than ever competing in an ever growing rat race, working far harder for a lot less wealth. This is entirely due to the underlying currency which does not retain its value for longer than 20 years. Thats right, a dollar bill has a lifetime of 20 years, in 20 years its worthless, you need 2 to equal one old dollar.

 

COMPLETELY apologise if it has come across that way. Not my intention in the slightest. My tone is only a reflection of my frustration with the point of view exhibited by the poster after I had contributed my fair share of time and effort, transparently writing clear and precise posts utilizing my years of knowledge and expertise on the subject matter. The poster instead has attempted to pick and choose my posts in an effort to match his personal conclusion that a gold standard is no different than a fiat standard.

 

Again, I apologise if I offended you or the poster.

[beerbaron]

I tough this cartoon would be appropriate for this thread...

 

BeerBaron

 

[moore_capital54]

I tough this cartoon would be appropriate for this thread...

 

BeerBaron

 

While I am being laughed at, my position keeps being reinforced by actual facts:

 

Hong Kong Starts Trading Gold in Yuan to Tap ‘Triple Demand’

http://www.businessweek.com/news/2011-10-16/hong-kong-starts-trading-gold-in-yuan-to-tap-triple-demand-.html

 

Great Piece which in a way provides more validation to the original purpose of this thread, and that is China gets it, and wants to soak up the world's gold.

[link01]

To Link01

 

that's 1 side of the equation. the other side, net wealth, would be the excess (or shortfall) of wealth created over dilution (money printing, deficits etc). if the  annual produce of the land and labour of the society increases 10% but deficits or inflation dilutes it by 4%, then you are still left with a net weath increase of 6%.

 

I absolutely disagree with you here, you are essentially lobbying that the government is allowed to steal 4% of the nations productivity wealth per annum? Why because some politicians decide to finance discretionary waste? How is that productive for society? that would be interesting to see.

 

fair enough, tho i think all fiat & even gold-backed currencies will inevitably fluctuate around a trend line relative to a nations productivity generated wealth & a basket of other globally competing currencies.

 

but i wonder: do you happen to have handy a long term chart of gold priced in dollars since the US abandoned the gold standard, & also gold priced in other major currencies during that period?

[link01]

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-10-16/hong-kong-starts-trading-bullion-in-yuan-to-tap-triple-demand-.html

 

 

[HJ]

Not so much "China gets it", as much as demand for gold in RMB term is as strong as that in USD term.  From the perspective of someone living and working in China, it's not clear at all that "China gets it".  More along the line of "The West really doesn't understand the political economy of China".  It's also not clear at all that if all capital control were to lift tomorrow, RMB would appreciate vs. USD.  The "moneyed class" in China (yes they exit now as opposed to 20 years ago when they dont'), are as nervous about what the future portends as those in the West. 

[biaggio]

If l lived in a communist country for the last 40 years I would be buying hard assets too.