muscleman Posted June 11, 2015 Share Posted June 11, 2015 I still believe VW will be a better match since they are weak in the U.S. FCA has good assets in the States. But VW already said they weren't interested. :'( Also the Angeles family does not want to sell out its Fiat stakes, but VW usually want to buyout everyone, so this will probably not work. It sounds like a cross-share holding structure with Renault is more likely outcome. Renault talked to GM about such a structure to set up a Renault-GM-Nissan alliance in 2006 but GM's CEO was playing jerk and wanted Renault to pay $10 bn per year or so to get GM into that alliance, so that broke up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phaceliacapital Posted June 11, 2015 Share Posted June 11, 2015 If you were VW and you were interested in Fiat, would you publicly state you are interested?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil_Buffett Posted June 11, 2015 Share Posted June 11, 2015 If you were VW and you were interested in Fiat, would you publicly state you are interested?? exactly!!! even gm says at the Moment it makes no sense, who will say at the first time in the first interview yeah i will buy fiat. makes no sense. Sergio Plays poker at the highest Level. he is the number 1 Player. iam again saying that in the end it will be VW. VW Needs fiat and especially chrysler. Patience friends. Sergio will bring us Dollars 8) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
indirect Posted June 11, 2015 Share Posted June 11, 2015 I agree, have patience with Sergio. You have been rewarded so far and will so in the future Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EliG Posted June 11, 2015 Share Posted June 11, 2015 Not sure if 24/7 Wall St. is a credible source... Fiat Chrysler Buyer May Be in China - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karthikpm Posted June 12, 2015 Share Posted June 12, 2015 Not sure if 24/7 Wall St. is a credible source... Fiat Chrysler Buyer May Be in China - It's conjecture , not based on any facts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sleepydragon Posted June 12, 2015 Share Posted June 12, 2015 Not sure if 24/7 Wall St. is a credible source... Fiat Chrysler Buyer May Be in China - It's conjecture , not based on any facts Does make sense though. china has huge pile of dollar that need to invest. SAIC could easily get dollar loans from chinese banks and this also allow chinese banks to expand market in US Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sportgamma Posted June 12, 2015 Share Posted June 12, 2015 Not sure if 24/7 Wall St. is a credible source... Fiat Chrysler Buyer May Be in China - It's conjecture , not based on any facts Does make sense though. china has huge pile of dollar that need to invest. SAIC could easily get dollar loans from chinese banks and this also allow chinese banks to expand market in US I don't see how it makes any sense. First of all, the author doesn't get it. FCA isn't putting itself up for sale and they aren't saying they have a capacity problem, but a capex problem. Secondly, with regard to SAIC ~90% of the vehicles they sell are either GM or VW related and therefore a combination wouldn't really solve the problem. I wander if Sergio has ever met Charlie Ergen... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buylowersellhigh Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 FCA and GM lining up financial advisers. http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/06/17/us-general-motors-m-a-fiat-chrysler-excl-idUSKBN0OX2P620150617 Not sure if 24/7 Wall St. is a credible source... Fiat Chrysler Buyer May Be in China - It's conjecture , not based on any facts Does make sense though. china has huge pile of dollar that need to invest. SAIC could easily get dollar loans from chinese banks and this also allow chinese banks to expand market in US I don't see how it makes any sense. First of all, the author doesn't get it. FCA isn't putting itself up for sale and they aren't saying they have a capacity problem, but a capex problem. Secondly, with regard to SAIC ~90% of the vehicles they sell are either GM or VW related and therefore a combination wouldn't really solve the problem. I wander if Sergio has ever met Charlie Ergen... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sportgamma Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 FCA and GM lining up financial advisers. http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/06/17/us-general-motors-m-a-fiat-chrysler-excl-idUSKBN0OX2P620150617 It´s very interesting to see how fast it has escalated after they came out with the presentation. If I were a betting man, my money would go on a VW & FCA merger. It just seems to be a more complimenting fit than GM & FCA as VW would get a bigger share of the US market as well as Brazil. It would also bring their LCV sales closer to Toyota and GM. Additionally, VW has been sniffing FIAT´s behind for a long time and with the current leadership turmoil at VW, this might be the right time for FCA to engage. It´s also worth considering that sheer volume is not everything. Look at BMW with its roughly 2 m. cars annually and very healthy margins and profits. A smaller combination might even make more sense for FCA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racemize Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 Well this was a scary sentence for investors: "For Marchionne it's now or never," an industry banker said, saying that industry valuations had reached their peak. With regard to the BMW comparison, I think that could make sense for a lot of the divisions of FCA, but not for the mass market ones (e.g., Dodge, Chrystler 200/300). What if they could sell mass market to one and luxury to another? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sportgamma Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 Well this was a scary sentence for investors: "For Marchionne it's now or never," an industry banker said, saying that industry valuations had reached their peak. With regard to the BMW comparison, I think that could make sense for a lot of the divisions of FCA, but not for the mass market ones (e.g., Dodge, Chrystler 200/300). What if they could sell mass market to one and luxury to another? It´s a very good point. I just used BMW as an example that you can actually run a very profitable automobile company with 2 million vehicles a year. So it´s not just about scale. BMW happens to operate in a segment with very high margins. If you look at what current FCA management has been doing since they took the reigns is reposition the their mix away from the mass and into the speciality segments. FIAT is a very good example of that. Almost have of their product assortment now are variations of the Chincochento. When they took over Chrysler they moved the Ram out of the Dodge family and put a lot of focus on Jeep and the high margin SUV market. It is not unthinkable that they would sell of Dodge and possibly Chrysler. Also, if you think about economics of scale. Where are they at? The Pernambuco plant can assemble 250.000 units a year and can handle 3 model types. So you don´t have to be a 10m unit operation to be efficient in assembly. The scale advantages seem to be in the r&d of the parts and being able share a platform. FCA management seems to be against the concept of sharing a platform through JV´s and would rather merge completely with another organisation. FCA say that they save $1B by designing the Jeep Renegade and 500X from the same platform. So, you would think that when considering a combination for two auto companies, the crucial aspect is how easy it will be to integrate under one platform and how do the two entities mix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fareastwarriors Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 Fiat Chrysler Brands Get Poor Ratings in Quality Study J.D. Power survey of buyers shows Chrysler, Jeep and Fiat brands among worst performers in industry http://www.wsj.com/articles/fiat-chrysler-brands-get-poor-ratings-in-quality-study-1434560748 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fareastwarriors Posted June 19, 2015 Share Posted June 19, 2015 Six reasons show Fiat Chrysler making play for GM http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/cars/2015/06/19/fiat-chrysler-fca-gm-merger/28969797/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sampr01 Posted June 23, 2015 Share Posted June 23, 2015 http://finance.yahoo.com/news/fiat-chryslers-alfa-romeo-puts-114925260.html http://finance.yahoo.com/news/feds-probe-jeep-wranglers-air-151945683.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PLynchJr Posted June 24, 2015 Share Posted June 24, 2015 New Alfa Romeo Giulia sedan debuted today. Looks awesome! First the 4C, now the Guilia...Alfa is heading in the right direction! 8) http://www.autoblog.com/2015/06/24/alfa-romeo-giulia-sedan-510-horsepower/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fareastwarriors Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 another strong month.... http://www.wsj.com/articles/BT-CO-20150701-705242 Fiat Chrysler Automobiles NV said Wednesday that its U.S. auto sales rose 8.2% in June, as strong sales of Jeep and Chrysler vehicles helped propel the auto maker to its best June sales since 2006. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
muscleman Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 another strong month.... http://www.wsj.com/articles/BT-CO-20150701-705242 Fiat Chrysler Automobiles NV said Wednesday that its U.S. auto sales rose 8.2% in June, as strong sales of Jeep and Chrysler vehicles helped propel the auto maker to its best June sales since 2006. They achieved this AFTER Jeep increased the price per SUV by 4%? That's very impressive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwoCitiesCapital Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 another strong month.... http://www.wsj.com/articles/BT-CO-20150701-705242 Fiat Chrysler Automobiles NV said Wednesday that its U.S. auto sales rose 8.2% in June, as strong sales of Jeep and Chrysler vehicles helped propel the auto maker to its best June sales since 2006. This is great relative to other car company results. GM was down 3% on the month. Ford was up only 1.6%. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EliG Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 This is great relative to other car company results. GM was down 3% on the month. Ford was up only 1.6%. GM retail sales were up 7%. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-07-01/fiat-chrysler-sales-streak-at-63-months-on-suv-pickup-demand "GM sales fell 3 percent in June, when analysts had anticipated a 3 percent increase, as the largest U.S. automaker slashed deliveries to rental-car companies by 45 percent. Sales to rental agencies tend to be less profitable, the Detroit-based automaker said in a statement. GM is stopping sales of fleet-only models, such as the Chevrolet Captiva, spokesman Jim Cain said in an e-mail. GM said its retail sales, which exclude discounted sales to bulk buyers, were up 7 percent in the month..." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwoCitiesCapital Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 This is great relative to other car company results. GM was down 3% on the month. Ford was up only 1.6%. GM retail sales were up 7%. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-07-01/fiat-chrysler-sales-streak-at-63-months-on-suv-pickup-demand "GM sales fell 3 percent in June, when analysts had anticipated a 3 percent increase, as the largest U.S. automaker slashed deliveries to rental-car companies by 45 percent. Sales to rental agencies tend to be less profitable, the Detroit-based automaker said in a statement. GM is stopping sales of fleet-only models, such as the Chevrolet Captiva, spokesman Jim Cain said in an e-mail. GM said its retail sales, which exclude discounted sales to bulk buyers, were up 7 percent in the month..." Thanks for the added clarity. The article I had seen didn't cover any of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Investmentacct Posted July 4, 2015 Share Posted July 4, 2015 Marchionne Sees Ferrari’s Value Exceeding $11 Billion in IPO http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-07-03/ferrari-valued-at-11-billion-or-more-in-ipo-marchionne-says Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbarberayr Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 So, if the value of Ferrari is $11 billion, of which 10% is owned by the family, it leaves about $10 billion inside FCAU. This $10 billion of value is being surfaced by raising $1 billion of cash into the company and the distribution of $9 billion in shares to the shareholders. The market cap of FCAU is $18 billion, so this implies that the rest of FCAU is only worth about $8 billion dollars. This would be way undervalued compared to the market. Even if FCAU just holds its current stock price and we get Ferrari shares, that would a 50% return this year (assuming the IPO goes ahead). Am I missing something here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
compounding Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 So, if the value of Ferrari is $11 billion, of which 10% is owned by the family, it leaves about $10 billion inside FCAU. This $10 billion of value is being surfaced by raising $1 billion of cash into the company and the distribution of $9 billion in shares to the shareholders. The market cap of FCAU is $18 billion, so this implies that the rest of FCAU is only worth about $8 billion dollars. This would be way undervalued compared to the market. Even if FCAU just holds its current stock price and we get Ferrari shares, that would a 50% return this year (assuming the IPO goes ahead). Am I missing something here? If by "holds its current stock price" you mean that the stub won't decline in price, I think you are being optimistic as to how the stub will trade after the separation. You also need to take the debt, which is quite substantial in comparison to other auto companies, into consideration. That being said, I agree it's cheap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fareastwarriors Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 Fiat Scion’s Strategy Toward GM: Patience John Elkann expects to press General Motors again on a merger within a couple of years http://www.wsj.com/articles/fiat-scions-strategy-toward-gm-patience-1436224474 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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