LC

I agree jay. Also remember they're NYSE listed now and want US funding. Showing the US market that they are willing to play fair is a step in that direction. The market wants Ferrari, Fiat wants funding on good terms.

One thing I have always had trouble with is valuing, or even having some mental models to draw upon when valuing, companies which are essentially fueled by acquisitions. Platform specialty products, Colfax, Valeant are some popular names right now but there are others of various size in different industries which exist and get lots of love from Wall Street. And through history, how many failures were there for every Teledyne? What was the distinguishing factor(s)? Obviously a great CEO but that is difficult to know ex-ante. How exactly does one look at these companies in terms of valuation? The hardest part in my opinion is due to lack of information on acquired companies pre vs. post acquisition. That causes difficulty in analysis. Also many of these companies use the model of acquiring these companies and changing the management and operating controls at these companies to "create value". What exactly that value is...this is usually only vaguely alluded to by management and not really detailed, making it harder to form an opinion on the true worth of their actions/system. It is rarely as simple as slashing unneeded expenses (although that is always the lowest hanging fruit it seems). With Valeant that seems to be the model but with other of these roll-up companies it may not be. The models I can think of are: -cutting redundant headcount to create more operating leverage. -leveraging sales channels, either to cross-sell current customers or expand regionally. -utilizing excess manuf. capacity and reducing fixed costs. -more "hazy" things such as leveraging R&D talent, patents, manuf. techniques etc. on larger scale. this seems difficult to measure. Any other random thoughts/references/information/examples is greatly appreciated. Thank you.

I like the idea of this thread, either to discover investment ideas or threats to existing investments. I am looking at the concrete industry and a forum member advised me to look at newer formulations of cement which do not require massive energy sucking kilns. One such is here : http://www.blueworldcrete.com/technology/ Other innovative types include sulphur cement Slagstar cement also looks promising (http://www.welantech.com/en/6petrochemical/12slagstar.htm) Energy efficiency is becoming more prominent in the industry with more restrictive environment guidelines and higher requirements for LEED buildings.

I also look at Tesuji partners which I don't believe has been mentioned.

Congrats Keith and nice piece Norm. Tombgrt I agree :)

Just a quick correction: Ginger man is on 36th between 5 and Madison

pull, format, visualize industry data

Either works for me(10am or a later lunch). Location ideas?

Ah thank you I missed that :)

More business (serious and funny) goes on in these sears threads than in the stores. i'll see myself out.

was the conference call auction taken down?

Detail of reported theft: $3.6 million of fake moustaches (book value $14.50) and a single $100,000 HDMI cord Edit: Also apparently stolen were 4 Kmart stores. Book value $14.95.

So they've been dead wrong for the last 6 years, but the market declines over a week & 1/2 period, and now they're right? This thread is ridiculous. I know you don’t like how Fairfax operates. And that’s fine! But let me ask you a question: if the market stays in some kind of turmoil for a while (a few months), if US government bond yields keep going down, and if Fairfax share price declines with the overall market, don’t you think it could be worth buying at least some shares before they announce 2014 year end results? Gio Why point was more about the point of this thread than the way the company operates. It's like someone buying JC Penny at $40, and then boasting that they were right when 2-years later the stock goes from $5 to $7. Diogenes can stop his search now, put down his lantern and rest. Here is an honest man. I had to Google this. I am still laughing. Heh me too. Kraven is one funny man :)

I find it interesting that the word "Hochschild" has only come up one time in this thread. Buffett's old situation seems very similar to Sears, albeit on a smaller scale: I acquired a Baltimore department store, Hochschild Kohn, buying through a company called Diversified Retailing that later merged with Berkshire. I bought at a substantial discount from book value, the people were first-class, and the deal included some extras - unrecorded real estate values and a significant LIFO inventory cushion. How could I miss? So-o-o - Three years later, I was lucky to sell the business for about what I had paid.

Davita, Collectors Universe, American Express, Philip Morris, maybe FICO? edit: Starbucks but I'm on the fence. Are they the McDonalds of coffee? If so, yes. This is one stock where I can't get over my own personal issues. I'm a coffee snob, I think their atmosphere ("third place") is too disingenuous, and I can't figure why anyone would go there time after time. So, probably Starbucks will outperform all the names above.

If there was only a way to make money off that. ;) Running for election is one way. 24/7 political news channels is another, TV/radio which air political commercials, hotels for political conventions, etc

Never underestimating the level of stupidity in the world is definitely true, but I think there are stronger reasons for not buying fiat shares than the listing. High debt levels, capital intensive industry, company transition, brand viewed as euro-centric, etc. But I am hoping you are correct :)

Why would that be the case? I never understood why listing on a different exchange would cause increased buying. I would love to be wrong but doesn't anyone who wants to buy Fiat able to do so already?

Bummer, looks like they'll just be reissued. Thanks peter.

Am I understanding correctly that 60mm shares were sold. 6mm shares were purchased by shareholders 54mm shares were purchased by Fiat So is this like a buyback of 54mm shares?

I found I got a lot better "with women" when I started dating women I genuinely liked, not who fit some description of "hot". So much easier in the end to just be yourself and, if she doesn't like it, cordially move on.

The embedded option is what is most valuable IMHO. Rates go lower? Refi. Rates go up? Enjoy below market rates. I take a real estate finance class as part of my MBA program and everyone is questioning the validity of the 30 year mortgage, whether it is still useful. I think from a consumer perspective it is inherently attractive. The class cites how people average only 7 years in their home, but I don't see how that makes the mortgage any less attractive of an instrument.

I could be wrong, since I don't know the SHLD-case that well, but isn't the main difference that the value creation in FCA isn't based on selling extremely illiquid assets? But instead, as you point out: on normalised earning power aided by a positive macro outlook, good management and price? Absolutely, although I wouldn't say the Sears RE is extremely illiquid. I look at SHLD as a real estate company with Eddie playing retailer at the helm. I.e. McDonalds without the strong retail operations.

Awwwww :D Congrats!

It's a fair point. The main difference I see is in the revenue line. Automakers have a bit of a tailwind behind them (fiat is no exception if we look at Chrysler sales) whereas Sears has no such tailwind. I also think marchionne's plan to increase revenue (more Ferrari, Maserati, jeep in china) is more feasible than shop your way.